Hi,

I'm writing a document about weapons and armours in Middle-earth and i want to know your opinion. At the moment I'm writing the armours and I have this. Any suggestion?


ARMOUR ENCUMBRANCE PROTECTION Price

Orc Mail shirt | 14 | 3d + 1 | 1C. (12 s.)
Orc Coat of mail | 18 | 4d + 1 | 3 C. (2 C.)
Orc Mail hauberk | 22 | 5d + 1 | na (5 C.)

Dwarf Mail shirt | 16 | 4d + 1 | na (5 C.)
Dwarf Coat of mail | 20 | 5d + 1 | na (12 C.)
Dwarf Mail hauberk | 24 | 6d + 1 | na (16 C.)

Mithril Mail shirt | 3 | 6d | na
Mithril Coat of mail | 4 | 8d | na
Mithril Mail hauberk | 5 | 10d | na

Scale Mail | 8 | 2d | 1 C. 4 s.(1 C. 4 s.)
Breastplate | 14 | 4d | na (10 C.)
Plate (breastplate with vambraces and greaves) | 28 | 7d | na (20 C.)

Bascinet | 3 | +2 | 180 p.

One type of armour that seems to get overlooked in fantasy games is "jack". This was made from horn plates sandwiched between layers of leather. Medieval accounts report it as being as being very effective. Although heavy and cumbersome it is easy to make and the materials are readily available. I could see it being used by Rhohirim, Woodmen, Beornings, and of course the Orcs.

Scale comes in a variety of styles, but I am not sure how much differentiation they need. Boiled leather (usually in wax or oil), bezaineted small coin sized scales, and larger thinner metal or lacquered scales laced together like Chinese and Japanese armours.

Mail is often used as a fairly generic term meaning simply "armour".

Weapons and armour are an area where Tolkien's writings (and perhaps the Hobbits' observations) are lacking in detail, as compaired to eg Robert E. Howard who was very specific in his choices of weapons and armour for his characters.

Your expansion looks good so far. Be sure the differences between "coat", "shirt" and "hauberk" get restated in your document. Also if you use one of these as the default define it as such. What I mean is "Three Uruk-hai clad in mail and bearing large shields blazoned with the red eye..." Which are they wearing? I would presum chain and most likely coats, but it is not clear. Think of it as developing a "style guide" for ToR.

I'd not use plate armour as Tolkien used "mail"very often for the same type of armour from the First to the dawn of the Fourth Age. There is no development seen here and the assumption he used it in the original medieval way ("chain"mail is a neologism) for the mesh of metal rings has at least some base. Positive evidence for "real" plate armour is lacking though (whether for good or bad is everyone's own decision). In this sense the movies were not very helpful IMHO.

The very light encumbrance for mithril armour is good IMO and its chief advantage. The higher protective values are OK in the light of the abstract combat system. Looking at more "realism", mail (from whatever material) is not very effective against blunt weapons as well as slashes and stabs that do not penetrate since the flexible material gives way: You don't get cut or slashed but suffer broken bones, organ contusions and/or bad bruises. All of these might be as bad as a slash or pierced bodypart. Frodo's experience with the orc-chieftain's spearhead or Náin's with Azog's blade is testimony to that.

But again, this cannot be simulated with such an abstract system and here you have to make compromises. Personally, I'd give mithril not such a big advantage in protection. A bonus of +1 or +2 over the dwarven armour (or 1d at most) would be sufficient. As already said, its lightweightness is the biggest advantage by far. With such adjustments, I'd find it perfect

Best
Tolwen

I'm not sure I'd give mithril its own listing. I'm thinking it should merely be a Protection bonus and Encumbrance reducer that is applied to the type of armor it was made into.

My suggestion:

For armor made from mithril:
1) Protection: Add +8 to the armor's original Protection.
2) Encumbrance: Divide the armor's original Encumbrance by 4, round down.

Therefore, a Mail Shirt (AB, p. 78) made from mithril would end up being:
Protection: 3d+8
Encumbrance: 3

Thoughts?

I cannot speak to the validity of your suggested numbers, but I think the idea of using Mithril as a modifier is a really good idea.

(I'm assuming that this would be a write-up for some kind of "official" release - whether Cubicle7 or Fanzine rather than a House Rule.)

I would suggest adding something like "can be used on metallic armor only" (so it cannot be applied to leather armor, for instance) and some consideration needs to be made for helms. While I cannot recall any mithril helm within Tolkien cannon, the above suggestion will get a rules lawyer thinking about it. Of course, their are chainmail coifs too although they are not accounted for within TOR's armor.

The helms of the guard in Minas Tirith had helms made of mithril.

Best
Tolwen

I just took the numbers as postulated in the original post ... the range for the number of dice was 6d to 10d, so I just used the middle one of 8d and made it a +8. Also, the Encumbrance appeared to be divided by 4, so I divided by 4 and rounded down.

True. These should not be confused with the City Guards, though ... these belonged to the Guards of the Citadel, the highest tier of the city ... in other words, the honor guard of Minas Tirith. Too, there were at least 3 companies of them as Beregond told Pippin he was a member of the Third Company in Return of the King (Book 5, Chapter 1). As a company could have anywhere from 80 to 225 troops (there's a VERY loose definition of the number throughout the world ... probably going with something approximating a British company from WWI would be a "safe" bet, I guess ... so, 100?) ... that's a lot of mithril helms! As befits the grandest city on the continent!

You're right of course. Thanks for the clarification. Even in Gondor during its power mithril was not for the common soldier of course

Best
Tolwen

Weren't their helmet inlaid with mithril rather than made out of it?

RotK says, "...but the helmets gleamed with a flame of silver, for they were indeed wrought of mithril, heirlooms from the glory of old days."

And, looking up the definition of wrought....

verb
1. Archaic except in some senses - a simple past tense and past participle of work.

adjective
2. worked.
3. elaborated; embellished.
4. not rough or crude.
5. produced or shaped by beating with a hammer, as iron or silver articles.

So, who knows? It could be inlaid with mithril (i.e., "elaborated; embellished") ... it could be completely made out of mithril (i.e., "produced or shaped by beating with a hammer"). The word and description aren't specific enough to say for certain. My thinking leans more towards the latter as I like the idea of Gondor's glory days being able to afford the austerity of such extravagances!

This post has been edited by Throrsgold on Mar 15 2012, 03:34 PM