Can characters recover Endurance point when resting on the road(sleeping in the wild for exemple)?
I am not sure of the answer.
I remember to have seen a topic about this subject but cannot find it anymore.

Thanks for the help.

Page 145 of Adventurer's Book:

RESTING
Adventurers recover by resting regularly, as they regain
Endurance points, shake off Weariness and see their
injuries finally mend.

Recover Endurance
Player-heroes recover a number of Endurance points for
every prolonged rest they enjoy every day (usually, a
night’s sleep). The amount of points recovered depends
on the current health of the character:

A Wounded hero with an untreated injury recovers one
Endurance point.

A Wounded hero with a treated injury recovers two
Endurance points.

An uninjured hero recovers two Endurance points, plus
a number of points equal to his Heart rating.

Shake off Weariness
A weary adventurer whose Endurance score is higher
than his Fatigue rating after a night’s sleep or comparable
rest is now properly rested.

A character who was Weary before he rested may now
uncheck the Weary label on his character sheet.

Heal Wounds
When the Endurance score of an injured character
reaches its maximum rating after a prolonged rest, the
hero is considered to have been finally restored to full
health, and the Wounded label on his character sheet
can be unchecked.

Update Fatigue Rating
If a hero reduced the total Encumbrance of his carried
gear before taking a prolonged rest, he may now update
his Fatigue rating accordingly (see page 107 for details)

The main errata of this passage is that any Fatigue gained during the Journey does not 'heal' until the character reaches a 'safe place' to rest - ie a Sanctuary.(available somewhere as TOR Errata)

Robin S. [B]

Thanks for posting the info. I have read that entry about "recovery" and wondered recently if resting in the woods etc while on a journey during the normal course of adventure (i.e. making camp for the night) is considered "Prolonged Rest" for the purpose of healing back Endurance Points.

Or if "Prolonged Rest" meant spending a day off the road in the comfort of an inn or home or other.

From reading the errata thread here: Errata Thread it appears that in order to count as a "prolonged rest" for recovery purposes the character must be in a safe place, not just camped by the road. The safe place need not be a "Sanctuary".

"There's a rule in the "Journeys" chapter that seems to have been lost during the design process, precisely the one referring to the recovery of increased Fatigue.

As stated earlier, you increase your Fatigue score by a number of points equal to the Encumbrance of your Travelling gear. This increase is applied at the end of the Journey (i.e. at the beginning of the next Episode).
For every prolonged rest you take at a safe place (i.e. not "on the road"), you lose 1 point of Fatigue increase due to failed Travel rolls.

This will most likely be included in an official errata document.

Amado A."

I presume an inn would count as a "safe place", but a side room in the Mines of Moria would not.

I am not clear on when fatigue is applied in a Journey with multiple legs. During each leg, each adventurer will make a number of fatigue tests depending on the season, the distance traveled, and the terrain crossed. Each failed fatigue test will increase the character's fatigue depending on equipment carried.
Is fatigue applied:
1. only at the end of the Journey as a whole?
2. at the end of each leg in which an adventurer suffered a failed travel test?

Obviously for a Journey with only one leg this is not an issue. Fatigue is applied at the end of the (single leg of the) Journey.

So color me completely confused.

The Errata addresses what a "prolonged rest" is; but only for the purpose of specifically removing/recovering "FATIGUE"; but not Endurance.

However, it does use the same terminology "Prolonged Rest" which is also cited as what is needed to recover Endurance on page 145 - and it defines "Prolonged Rest" as in a safe (not via a campsite on the road).




So given that can I confidently say:

Healing Fatigue OR Endurance is done via Prolonged Rest - which is defined by being in a safe and comfortable (i.e. not while out in the wild after making camp for the night).



Furthermore, having now read the errata thread, it appears that failed Travel Rolls increase the Fatigue at the END of the journey - which makes sense only because the "Travel" check is done at the beginning of a journey, and one wouldn't become immediately fatigued so at the end makes sense from that perspective - but if it's applied at the end of a journey - isn't that when a Fellowship Phase is next, and is most assuredly implied they would staying at a decent/safe recovering the loss of fatigue that their failure garnered - thus making the failed Travel check really not cause any true issue whatsoever????


Color me confused.

Actually now i'm doubting my doubt.

As I re-read the un-official Errata - it says:

"For every prolonged rest you take at a safe place (i.e. not "on the road"), you lose 1 point of Fatigue increase due to failed Travel rolls."


So now I'm thinking that "prolonged rest" doesn't equate to taking respite at a safe ; but instead it may be implying a distinction between "Recovering Endurance" and "Recovering Increased Fatigue".

The former states (on page 145 AB) "
"Recover Endurance: Player-heroes recover a number of Endurance points for every prolonged rest they enjoy every day (usually, a night’s sleep). The amount of points recovered depends on the current health of the character:..."


But no indication of the prolonged rest needing to be done in a safe


The latter states (via un-official errata):
"For every prolonged rest you take at a safe place (i.e. not "on the road"), you lose 1 point of Fatigue increase due to failed Travel rolls."


This may mean that although a "prolonged" rest can help you recover Endurance, you can only recover Fatigue if that Prolonged Rest was done at a safe locale.



Perhaps I'm thinking too much into it - but bottom line I would like to know 'officially' if Endurance healed via prolonged rest must be done at the same type of "safe " as is required to recover increased Fatigue? or is any nights rest good enough to earn back those Endurance Points.

One more question: it states that

"an UNINJURED hero can recover a number of Endurance points equal to two plus it's heart rating"

I assume then that "Uninjured" means "did not suffer a WOUND"

Because technically any loss of Endurance is some sort of injury albeit minor.


A character that is WOUNDED is not at full health until it's Endurance reaches it's maximum.

My question is: what about a WOUNDED character that was ALSO Weary? Does he remove the WEARY after a nights rest? OR does that not go away either until his Endurance is at it's maximum???

While this might not be of much help to you, I thought I would offer up this definition of a Safe Place. It just seems pertinent here in case further discussion on the subject of recovery occurs.

Safe Place: Any physical where a character or party may rest with little or no possibility (80%+) of enemy action to disrupt their recovery from mental and physical exhaustion and injury. The exact can be almost anywhere, including out in the wild, provided the character(s):

1. are not required to consistently act in a cautious manner (constant sneaking, whispering, etc)
2. need not engage in continuous guard duty (24 hrs/day for more than 1.5 days)
3. can be treated as guests (no duties/chores) for at least a week (healthy characters can treat unhealthy members in this manner)
4. receive minimal medical attention, if needed, to sustain life
5. are in a tranquil setting to ease stress

Note that I have not said anything about being indoors or within urban centers, as many of the comments in these forums about recovery seem to be alluding to, as ultimately I think SG/C7 did not mean to automatically exclude recovery in natural settings.

Meanwhile, I will try to do some more reading on these issues.

They way I understand the rules, and also errata'd rules. Is that Endurance would be recovered every day of rest, one nights sleep, uninterrupted. And use the rules for recovering lost endurance. This rest need not necessarily be in a safe place, as you are only resting and 'healing naturally', getting bandages changed if wounded etc.

For recovering Fatigue gained from failed travel rolls, then the party would have to rest in 'a safe place' and not on the road. This is left up to you really, it could be some kind of Inn, perhaps a fairly safe village or settlement, or even an old ruin that can be well defended or even have some kind of enchantment attached to it that aids weary travellers. A rule I use is to get the Scout make and Explore roll, and depending on the level of success, have them find a safe place to stay and give them the option of staying to recover or move on. Of course you could have this 'safe place' come up as part of your adventure.

Also when resting to recover Fatigue in this way I have my party spend an entire day at the for each point of Fatigue they want to loose.

And to your query about applying the gained Fatigue at the end of the Journey, it need not be at the Fellowship phase, as soon as they are finished travelling to their destination then apply the new Fatigue level and then continue your adventure, then it would recover during the next Fellowship Phase.

Regards,

Chris

In summary....

To recover Fatigue, you need to be in a safe place and rest, so this can't be done while travelling or adventuring, unless you spend the night in a tavern on the road, the Easterly Inn being an option if you own Tales of Wilderland.

Endurance is recovered with a nights rest, whether that be in a safe place or in the Wilds.

And yes, Uninjured means Unwounded.

There are different healing rates for an Untreated Wound, Treated Wound and Unwounded (1, 2 and 2+Heart) (Adventurers Book 145).

Thanks to all who have partaken in this thread - this has been very informative.

So I have made sense of all the nuances at this point except for the quoted text above. Here is what I cannot seem to wrap my mind around and it is most likely because I just haven't figured out the actual processes yet.


Isn't the "Destination" the "end of the journey" which then proceeds naturally to a Fellowship Phase?


Here is how I understand it:

1_) Players decide on destination.
2_) Player scrawl on map where/how they get there.
3_) LM calculates journey's length of time and difficulty level in overcoming Fatigue etc based on the level of corruption of the land.
4_) Players roll Lore (optional) and then Fatigue Tests (not optional)
5_) Journey commences - hazards handled, adventures transpire.
6_) Destination reached. Adventure denouement
7_) Fellowship Phase



If Fatigued from failed test on step 4 doesn't actually affect until Destination is reached, then the party's next step is the Fellowship Phase - where they can rest effectively and make failed Travel checks irrelevant.


What am I doing wrong?

Thanks Garbar and Chris, it makes sense now.

As for Fatigue from failed travel tests it is applied at the end of the journey, which may be immediately before a Fellowship but also may not be.

For example a Company makes a Journey to a ruin where they plan to confront a bandit chieftain. Fatigue from the Journey is applied when the reach the ruin. This happens if the next thing the Company does is go straight into the attack on the bandits (in the same play session), or if they pause to formulate a plan possibly including resting briefly before the attack (Endurance could be recovered but not Fatigue), or break until the next play session. It is unlikely their will be a safe haven nearby for the Company to restion and cover Fatigue. Obviously a Fellowship phase at this point would be inappropriate.

This is what I was trying to say. If you have any sort of actions planned for immediately after the Journey stage then you would apply the gained Fatigue at this point.

To me it would seem a bit of an anti-climax if after travelling, the Company just went into a Fellowship Phase. Unless, of course, there was adequate encounters along the way which was the point of the Adventuring Phase i.e. The company are going from A to B but along the way they stumble into a large party of Orcs planning a raid on a nearby town or settlement and they have to figure out how best to solve it. In that example I would apply any gained Fatigue when they discover the Orcs, even though they have not completed their Journey as it is a reasonable amount of time, 'off the road', for them to feel the tiredness of the Journey so far.

Again, you could easily do the entire Journey, then have something happen to them at their destination, having them gain the extra Fatigue, because they will be too busy with whatever adventures you have planned to properly rest.

I hope this is a little clearer.

Regards,

Chris.

Fatigue is easy to apply.

At the end of the Journey(before the Company reaches is planned destination, like when the heroes reaches the Part Three of the Marsh-Bell) and/or before a Hazard Episode(see the rulebook).

Or even a special Episode of the Loremaster conception where Fatigue can influance the outcome of the Episode.

SirKicley,
I think where you're getting hung up is a matter of timing and scale.

You seem to be thinking that the characters must be affected by the fatigue as they travel (timing). So the character's actions and combat are negatively impacted during the Journey. And, at each failed test, more negative impact accrues (scale) to the characters.

Whereas I think Chris is saying that it's kind of a toggle; either the characters are fine or they are fatigued (scale). Once toggled, more fatigue is ignored during the remainder of the Journey. The characters experience the additional fatigue when they stop Journeying or attempt to rest (timing). During this attempt to heal up and de-stress the characters find they are worse off than they thought. Requiring extra time and effort to throw off the affects of their Journey.


BTW, nice summation, and an excellent discussion.

Trust me - I'm not trying to be obtuse - but it's not as simple as you state. Worded as you put - it's quite confusing:

If you haven't reached your destination yet - you haven't finished your journey! It breaks some sort of law of physics to be at the end of your journey but haven't yet reached your destination. At least not literally.

Your example of "reaching part III in the marsh bell" sounds quite reasonable, but they still haven't reached their destination. Destination literally means "Final".

If on the other hand you want to break the entire journey up into "legs" and apply it that way (which makes way more sense to me) then have it explain it that way - which it doesn't.


I have adopted Ashley's ideas of having "legs of a journey" and will use the Lore checks and Travel checks beginning of each leg. I've taken to apply any failure results increase Fatigue during that leg of the journey. It's not impossible to imagine fatigue happening even as early as the first leg. Perhaps the person wasn't prepared with the right gear. Forgot to pack his backback correctly. Packed the wrong travelling gear. Shoes have holes in them. Whatever. The point is - it should have a near immediate effect.

Someone else who said that they would have the Fatigue apply upon coming upon some ruins along the way that they choose to investigate. Which again makes sense - and falls better into the various "legs of a journey" idea. But from a literal sense - it isn't written as intuitively to make room for this. Which is the very crux of my confusion over the whole mechanic.

It seems overall much easier to either apply it when the failed roll happens, or break the "journey" into legs and apply it at the beginning of the next legs. For the record - many of the "journey" planned by my PCs are to effectively travel from one locale to another. The "adventure" is the goings-on that happens to them, what they discover, hazards encounters etc all along the way. Recovering from Fatigue as written in the rules is not an issue when the adventure is the journey and not the destination of the journey.

Yes that sounds about right. Being used as described (in my mind) makes it a completely useless mechanic and unnecessary.

As I said in my previous post - most journeys ARE destined to arrive at a "safe Location" No one plans to end an adventure within a Turkish Prison for instance.


I can see sometime travelling to a Hot Spot is part of a campaign that you are going specifically to root out an evil or investigate or search for something missing etc. But TOR has a lot of emphasis on just journeying and exploration. Not "dungeon stomping".




The adventure in the Tales of the Wild in which the heroes escort Baldor across the Mirkwood is a perfect example.

SPOILER BELOW

Their destination is NOT a problem. The problems are what happens to them along the way. Their planned destination is a safe place.

What's the point of assigning Fatigue once they get there? It should already be in effect when they meet the spiders or the hermit or whatever - at least that's my opinion. If it's the former - then the mechanic is pointless.

Sorry for the short comment.
But english is not my mother tongue...

An adventure is divided in Episodes. Fatigue take effect before an episode if the Loremaster judge it appropriate.
And Hazard encouters are special episodes.


Thanks to everyone who have taked parts in the discussion.

Sir Kicley,
To answer your specific points with regards to the discussion (as I cannot comment about Tales as I don't have it yet), here are my thoughts.

Q: What's the point of assigning Fatigue once they get there?
A: First off, I assume you mean Baldor arrives at his intended safe destination, fatigued, but otherwise without incident or interruption (just to limit the variables). So what is the point of accruing more fatigue upon arrival? In two related phrases, Departure Time and Length of Recovery. Perhaps Baldor planned to arrive in town, rest a day and head onward. Now, with the additional fatigue, he is required to stay in town and rest up for a longer period of time. The extended stay is mandatory.

Q: It should already be in effect when they meet the spiders or the hermit or whatever - at least that's my opinion.
A: In a strange way, it is, it just is not felt by the character. The mechanic for this is to apply the effect immediately at the end of travel.

The best example I can give is IRL long-distance and marathon runners experience this effect. While they are moving they start getting tired, perhaps injured. But as they are mentally willing to accept these affects, they power through them and continue. Eventually (assuming their bodies can withstand the stress) they stop moving and then totally collapse with torn ligaments, dehydration, heat prostration, etc. Now these runners were experiencing these effects before, but they ignored them so it was as if they were just occurring once the runner stopped.

It is the same kind of thing here. It is not that the character is not getting fatigued along the way. Just that finally given the opportunity to rest, the character pays attention and actually feels their fatigue. To simulate this within the game you just apply the fatigue once the character stops traveling.

Actually, anyone who has gotten a blister and didn't feel it until hours later has experienced something similar to this deferred fatigue.

I can hike all day as long as I keep moving. It's when I stop that tired muscles stiffen up.

As for the application of Fatigue while traveling, depending on how the LM interprets "episodes" it could be that the Journey until that nest of spiders is encountered is all treated as a Journey, but stopping to fight the spiders constitutes a "new episode" in which case Fatigue would be applied before combat is resolved. Likewise it is LM's discretion as to whether resolving other Hazzards or unanticipated occurrences during travel constitute separate "episodes", if they do then Fatigue is applied before they are solved, if not then Fatigue is not applied (yet).

First, trust me that I do not think you’re wrong or doing anything incorrectly or being misleading. I’m either not doing things right all along, misunderstanding the rules, or my confusion on this topic is simply not being conveyed well or understood wells. Allow me to try a different approach:

THIS is what I can’t seem to put into a box. (Assuming we’re going ‘by the book.’) According to the Adventures Handbook, a Journey/Adventuring Phase precedes a Fellowship Phase. Two (or maybe three) such Adventure Phases occur each year – and then the Fellowship Phase at the end of the year is the “YEAR END” fellowship phase.

Taking this into account – the “Destination” of the journey/adventuring phase in the given scenario in Tales from the Wild, is a ‘safe place’. The Journey/adventure is over. A Fellowship Phase is thematically meant to follow. A Fellowship Phase is listed as approximately a week to a month given the LM preferences – up to 3 months in years-end Fellowship Phase.

Laying the aforementioned down as ground work – what I take from the rules and scenario adventure:

Heroes Plan Adventure w/ Baldor
LM plots time/distance
Heroes Roll Lore and Travel *(Fatigue)
Adventure Happens – including many encounters along the way as written and any hazards that occur
Heroes reach destination. Journey/Adventure over
Fatigue Sets In
Fellowship Phase Happens
Fatigue recovers

Heroes Plan New Adventure.
Rinse and repeat.

What part of that equation/itinerary do I have mixed up? As written in the Errata – the Fatigue is listed to affect the heroes at the end of the journey. If it’s intended to actually hamper heroes during the adventure – it isn’t written that clearly and is not intuitive enough to make that conclusion – without “house rules”.

I certainly do not disagree with these RL analogies. The only thing that these RL scenarios do not truly give the mechanic of the game justice or simulate accurately is the fact that a Journey/adventuring Phase is SEVERAL days – several weeks in fact! A person who gets a blister on the first day of Hiking – even the sixth day - isn’t going to delay feeling it till day 22 when they finally get to Rivendell. I’ve hiked, I’ve camped, I’ve spend days touring Disneyland on a five day pass. And just like those scenarios our Heroes are virtually resting every night schucking off their packs etc to rest, sleep in uncomfortable environments and then pressing on the next day. It’s completely likely that you’ll feel fatigue the first morning after resting by a campfire in an unsafe environment. I am not convinced that Fatigue will only kick in once they reach a destination of 3 weeks worth of walking. (How many days does it take to walk through Mirkwood – it think it was like 29 days!) Even Marathon runners only run for one day. Sure they feel the fatigue at the end – but I daresay that they’re ready the next morning to do it again. NFL players can barely walk on Monday following a game. They’re not ready to do it all again for a week! And I dare say that a hobbit can be compared to a marathon runner, or NFL player. Using your “blister” reference and feeling it as a result: I would be comfortable and confident with a logical ruling that upon a failed “Fatigue” test (travel skill check) the Fatigue takes effect soon after the adventure begins. It only takes a day to gain a blister and it’s felt the next day. And there are many other anatomical/physiological issues that can crop up that can be explained for the mechanical detriment within the game: crick in the neck from sleeping on rocks (Sam complained of it), not eating enough (second breakfast being missed), eating something that disagrees with you, catching a cold from being in the weather, blisters, sore muscles form walking, carrying etc. Maybe these are not felt the first day – maybe not even the fifth. But certainly believable to occur before Day 20 on the road.

In the end - while I don’t have a problem assuming that Fatigue would be primarily felt at the “end” of some sort of Travel or distance travelled – I do not see the logic in it only applying at the end of a lengthy journey, and I don’t see the usefulness of the mechanic if used as written to affect at the end of an adventure when by the very way things are written, is supposed to be followed by a Fellowship Phase. The Sole exception being if/when the “destination” after a long Journey is a tomb/crypt/keep/dungeon to explore. Which may or may not be a common theme dependant on the style of play of a group. For me – it seems to be more adventures are as a result of simply travelling to another locale and being able to rest freely once there.



To use analogies that we can all relate to: In the Fellowship of the Ring when they headed out for their adventure – their “Destination” (Using TOR rules/mechanics) was Rivendell to see the elves. Their adventure – being chased by Nazgul, scare at Prancing Pony, Midgemarsh etc…….all that happened on the the Journey to Rivedenll (The Adventure Phase). Upon Arriving at Rivendell, yes Frodo was WOUNDED, and the hobbits were no doubt “Fatigued” BUT it was a safe locale – they were specifically going to a safe locale and fatigue would never have been a concern to them if they only had to feel it once they got there. Their next Journey in their mind (at the time they planned the trip to Rivendell) would be to return to The Shire. Another safe Locale.

Granted the next Journey they undertook the “destination” became Mt.Doom and not the Shire – but that was a change of plans. And it’s just as plausible that most of them knew it was a suicide mission anyways. Fatigue was the least of their worries when they got there. Truthfully if my players wanted to plot a journey to Mt.Doom – I wouldn’t even care about the Fatigue.

And THAT is what I have had an issue with all along. The errata and the mechanics are not intuitively written to prevent confusion.

Technically the characters quit travelling every day. You and I both feel fatigue while hiking – every day afterwards. The following day we are not 100% of what we were the first day. Fatigue is already setting in. Should it be applied to characters on the second day? Maybe. Maybe not. I assume that’s the point of a “FATIGUE TEST” – to determine if it does.

I suppose ultimately it is up to the LM on how he assumes/construes a “journey”. I’ve been led to believe all along by the Adventures Book that a Journey is the ENTIRE shebang! From the beginning of the Adventuring Phase to the end. If the words being used are “end of journey” and “destination” then to me at least that implies when the characters get to where they are going – not the in between encounters that they face.

If on the other hand we are meant to apply Fatigue at each of these…..then I’m completely on board with that – but it needs to be clarified that this was the intent so as to not force house rules to make sense of it. I didn’t see the errata mention “new episode” for the record. Though I’m inclined that it makes more sense to do that. And if were going to go with “each new episode” then we may as well consider the “legs of a journey” as a true concept and use that as the foundation for when Travel checks should be made and when Fatigue should take effect. But that is the way I’ve been doing it.



Thanks for the reply.

I believe the books present the rules to the game in a very specific sequence, and that the sequence is meant to be followed in the correct order. Doing so, these questions about the timing of Fatigue go away.

Adventurer's Book, p. 155: "When the preliminary rolls and choices have been made, it is time to resolve the Fatigue tests."

"All tests are resolved at the same time for all characters."

"When a player-hero fails a Fatigue test, he increases his Fatigue score by a number equal to the Encumbrance value of his Travelling gear..."

So players roll Fatigue tests simultaneously, and if they fail they increase their heroes' Fatigue scores immediately. There is no mention here of waiting until the end of the journey.

"If at least one player fails the test and the Feat die ends up showing the <Eye of Sauron> icon, a Hazard sequence has been triggered..."

The Hazard sequence occurs as soon as the failure with the <Eye> occurs. Since the player failed the Fatigue test, he has also increased his Fatigue score just before the Hazard.

Since the Loremaster is keeping track of where the heroes are on their journey, he also knows where they are if they trigger a Hazard.

Note that Hazards and Encounters are different things. "An encounter is almost never the product of a random die result, and is usually part of the Loremaster's plans for the current adventuring phase..." But Hazards are always triggered randomly. Thus, the two are not the same.

Thus, the complete journey sequence is:

1. PLANNING
   1. The Company decides on a destination.
   2. The Company shows the Loremaster their planned route on their map.
   3. The Loremaster calculates the distance traveled.
   4. The Loremaster modifies the distance for terrain.
   5. The Loremaster divides the modified distance by the speed of the Company to get the total number of days to travel.
   6. The Company may opt to make Lore rolls to improve aspects of the journey.
   7. Company members choose their roles for the journey.
2. TRAVELING
   1. Start of Day
      • Players are entitled to two tasks each.
      • If 3, 4, 5, or 6 days have passed since start of journey or last Fatigue test, all members of the Company roll one Fatigue test.
        • If a Fatigue test fails, the hero who failed it immediately gains 1 or 2 points of Fatigue, depending on his Travelling Gear.
        • If a Fatigue test fails with an <Eye>, a Hazard is triggered immediately.
        • If the Loremaster decides to include a Corruption test for the day's journey, it is rolled now.
        • If the Loremaster chooses to introduce an encounter at this time, the encounter occurs.
   2. End of Day
      • If the Company makes camp for the night, and if anyone is not at full Endurance points, they regain a number of Endurance points depending on their Wound status.
      • If the journey is not complete, go back to Start of Day for the next day.
3. The Company arrives at its destination.

Now, I wouldn't actually use this outline too carefully, because it performs every day of the journey as if the heroes want to do all sorts of interesting things every single day. I showed it to demonstrate the complete sequence. More often it will be abbreviated to only include Fatigue tests and special actions the players tell the Loremaster about ahead of time.

SirKicley,
First, my apologies for not responding quicker. I've noticed these boards do not always show new messages if, between checking the Forum topic listing and posting a message in a topic, several minutes elapse and new messages are posted. (I don't use the New Messages function because I don't follow any of the other C7 forums but this one.) Perhaps I'm doing something incorrectly regarding Forum usage in this respect. Anyway....

As for communication, I think I understand you. And I think you understand me. But we were having a disconnect due to the length of time covered by the game mechanic. However, your last post seems to have gotten us to the same understanding.

I think you are correct. This extended discussion is exacerbated by the "Flavor over Mechanics" writing tone used in game mechanics areas of the text. I have no complaint with the Flavor taking precedence where the mechanics are not being explained / discussed.

This is the exact reason why I am a Rules Lawyer. I prefer all games to write clearly defined mechanics with rigid boundaries so that any controller can understand the intended limits of the RAW. After providing us all the hard details, make a point of saying "but apply them gently, if at all" to prevent boxing the players in and thereby undermining the fun of playing this game.


Stormcrow,
Thanks for adding your comments. I think the sequencing of events might have been very helpful in illustrating the differences between SirKicley's and other's interpretation of the game mechanic.

Didn't someone post a short, step-by-step example journey, delineating when and where rolls were made? It included a non-detailed hazard/encounter, along with Wound and endurance recovery, during the journey and after destination arrival.

First thank you for the play by play.

This is how I've done it since day one, but it was the wording in the (unofficial) errata thread that seems to contradict this or possibly update it.

Wherein the wording specifically says "fatigue penalties assigned at the end of the journey"


Regardless how you wrote it is how I continue to implement and adjudicate it.

Cool beans. Thanks for chiming in. It's a long time coming but I do think we do finally understand both sides of the coin and the situation. I appreciate the discussion and attempts at working it together.