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> Npc Vs Npc Combat
Narl
Posted: Sep 8 2011, 03:53 PM
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I had a situation in the game last night where a couple of NPCs were helping out the Fellowship. I don't think this is addressed anywhere in the rules so I thought I'd see what thoughts everyone might have on it.

The problem is that since the TNs to hit and be hit are all determined by stances (which are generally only a PC thing), do you think I should be assigning stances to NPCs who are fighting on the side of the Company?

I just had them default to Open (TN 9) and went with it. Any other ways you can think of to handle this?
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mindshadow2k
Posted: Sep 8 2011, 04:13 PM
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Personally I would probably let the players run them during the combat to keep things off of me as the LM, but then again it is really a situation thing.
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Skywalker
Posted: Sep 8 2011, 05:23 PM
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If the NPCs are non-central characters, I would just hand wave their fighting.

If the NPC was somehow central, which should be pretty rare, stat them up as a PC and operate them accordingly.


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“There is nothing like looking, if you want to find something. ... You certainly usually find something if you look, but it is not always quite the something you were after."
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Wightbred
Posted: Sep 10 2011, 01:12 AM
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I'd just hand wave this, or say the NPC gives a damage or Parry bonus to a PC.

I was thinking about PvP the other night and I wondered if you could use the most defensive stance to set the TN. For example, two PCs start fighting, and one chooses Forward and the other Defensive, so they all use 12+ for a TN. I think I'll do this if it ever comes up.
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thriddle
Posted: Sep 11 2011, 06:26 PM
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Can either of you say a little more about *how* you think you would handwave it? I mean, I can think of some possibilities, but I'm not sure exactly what you're imagining. Thanks!
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Skywalker
Posted: Sep 11 2011, 07:27 PM
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QUOTE (thriddle @ Sep 11 2011, 10:26 PM)
Can either of you say a little more about *how* you think you would handwave it? I mean, I can think of some possibilities, but I'm not sure exactly what you're imagining. Thanks!

I would assess the capabilities of the two combatants and narrate appropriately, much like you do for any NPC outside of the immediate spotlight of the game I am running.


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Wightbred
Posted: Sep 12 2011, 10:08 AM
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QUOTE (Skywalker @ Sep 12 2011, 09:27 AM)
QUOTE (thriddle @ Sep 11 2011, 10:26 PM)
Can  either of you say a little more about *how* you think you would handwave it? I mean, I can think of some possibilities, but I'm not sure exactly what you're imagining. Thanks!

I would assess the capabilities of the two combatants and narrate appropriately, much like you do for any NPC outside of the immediate spotlight of the game I am running.

Exactly.

Here's a funny story from years ago that I always use to remind me what is important. Playing with a GM who was playing two NPCs in a discussion with the PCs. The PCs started to leave the scene until only the NPCs were left, but the GM kept having a conversation with himself for several minutes until he realized that none of the players had the slightest interest and stopped. I find it rare that an exchange that doesn't involve a PC is worth wasting time on dice rolls for.
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thriddle
Posted: Sep 12 2011, 07:28 PM
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QUOTE (Wightbred @ Sep 12 2011, 02:08 PM)
QUOTE (Skywalker @ Sep 12 2011, 09:27 AM)
QUOTE (thriddle @ Sep 11 2011, 10:26 PM)
Can  either of you say a little more about *how* you think you would handwave it? I mean, I can think of some possibilities, but I'm not sure exactly what you're imagining. Thanks!

I would assess the capabilities of the two combatants and narrate appropriately, much like you do for any NPC outside of the immediate spotlight of the game I am running.

Exactly.

Here's a funny story from years ago that I always use to remind me what is important. Playing with a GM who was playing two NPCs in a discussion with the PCs. The PCs started to leave the scene until only the NPCs were left, but the GM kept having a conversation with himself for several minutes until he realized that none of the players had the slightest interest and stopped. I find it rare that an exchange that doesn't involve a PC is worth wasting time on dice rolls for.

Oh, for sure. I mean, if it's just two NPCs fighting each other, no problem. I was thinking more of the OP's question about an NPC fighting alongside the PCs. That could happen quite a bit.

One option that occurred to me was just to have the NPC's outcomes (assuming that they're not vastly better or worse than the PCs, and vastly better is very dull!) mirror those of the average party member for the round. The end result will be to have the NPC basically keep one or two NPCs or Orcs (etc.) engaged, and to have them finally drop their opponents when the PCs do the same. If the PCs turn and run, either the NPC runs with them, or gets cut down, GM's choice.

Something like that?
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Skywalker
Posted: Sep 13 2011, 12:01 AM
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QUOTE (thriddle @ Sep 12 2011, 11:28 PM)
Oh, for sure. I mean, if it's just two NPCs fighting each other, no problem. I was thinking more of the OP's question about an NPC fighting alongside the PCs. That could happen quite a bit.

One option that occurred to me was just to have the NPC's outcomes (assuming that they're not vastly better or worse than the PCs, and vastly better is very dull!) mirror those of the average party member for the round. The end result will be to have the NPC basically keep one or two NPCs or Orcs (etc.) engaged, and to have them finally drop their opponents when the PCs do the same. If the PCs turn and run, either the NPC runs with them, or gets cut down, GM's choice.

Something like that?

Sounds fine. I personally don't see the distinction of NPCs fighting NPCs based on proximity to PCs. Same principles apply in both cases.


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Sir Gawain
Posted: Sep 13 2011, 05:13 AM
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QUOTE (thriddle @ Sep 11 2011, 10:26 PM)
Can  either of you say a little more about *how* you think you would handwave it? I mean, I can think of some possibilities, but I'm not sure exactly what you're imagining. Thanks!

I just roll the feat die.
High result means the good guy has the advantage; low result means it's the evil one who's prevailing. Maybe with Gandalf's rune/eye of Sauron there is a clear victory, and the opponent is dead/fleeing/lying unconscious etc.

But, of course, that happens only if the NPCs' fight has no big impact on my PCs' actions. If it has, I simply decide the outcome, which will be mostly based on plot requirements.


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