What other kind of Valour tests are there? I only see them applied to Fear tests in the LM book. Am I missing the obvious?

Thanks, Rich. It's in the other books. I was only looking at the LM's book and when I couldn't find it I began to wonder if my memory was slipping because I remembered them in play.Rich H wrote:There are tests for Valour other than Fear Tests but they are rare.
P37 TfW
P142 TfW
P57 DoM
P115 DoM
... to name some.
No problem! I went through the PDF searching for Valour when it was used in a non-Fear based test. It's the only way I could find them.beckett wrote:Thanks, Rich. It's in the other books. I was only looking at the LM's book and when I couldn't find it I began to wonder if my memory was slipping because I remembered them in play.
That's an interesting point of view, but that would raise Valour importance a bit too much over Wisdom IMHO.Rocmistro wrote:When I first began Loremastering TOR, I was under the impression that Fear tests (Valour) and Corruption tests (Wisdom) both ended in the same result (Shadow Point gain).
My thinking was that failure and cowardice (or rather, a hero's self-condemnation of cowardice due to a failed fear test) was as equally damning to a hero's spirit and would result in the accumulation of Shadow Points.
It wasn't until later that I realized that Fear tests "only" resulted in a limitation on the ability to invoke attribute bonuses.
In hindsight, I think it's perfectly reasonable to award shadow points based on failed fear tests.
Under this (mis)understanding of Fear tests, a Barding's Cultural Blessing becomes very useful.
That's an interesting idea, but on the other hand, I don't think failing a Fear test means being cowardly. It is perfectly fine to be afraid of a Nazgul, but if you still decide to fight it, why should you gain Shadow? It is pretty heroic.Rocmistro wrote:In hindsight, I think it's perfectly reasonable to award shadow points based on failed fear tests.
Agreed. It makes Valour a bit too good. But, at the time I was running it, I didn't realize that what Fear Tests actually did, so it all worked out ok. Now that I do realize what fear tests do, I would consider adjudicating exactly as you indicated.Michebugio wrote: That's an interesting point of view, but that would raise Valour importance a bit too much over Wisdom IMHO.
However I think I'm stealing from you this rule, but award a Shadow Point only on a failed Fear check that has an Eye result on the Feat dice (essentially, making it equal to the less dangerous Corruption check type). A normal failure should not be considered cowardice, maybe only self-preservation instinct: but a catastrophic failure (Eye) has more likely moral consequences on the character, since it would mean he screams, or he tries to demoralize his companions ("WE'RE DOOMED!").
I think they key difference is that it's not an onlooker's opinion of one's "cowardice" but rather a self-condemnation. In other words, an independent bystander might say "You faced down a Nazgul! That is incredibly brave and heroic regardless of the outcome or how well you did!" Whereas the hero himself might think "Perhaps, but there is more that I could have done had I only acted a bit more bravely!"Yusei wrote:That's an interesting idea, but on the other hand, I don't think failing a Fear test means being cowardly. It is perfectly fine to be afraid of a Nazgul, but if you still decide to fight it, why should you gain Shadow? It is pretty heroic.Rocmistro wrote:In hindsight, I think it's perfectly reasonable to award shadow points based on failed fear tests.
I think one could give shadow points when a failed fear test has negative consequences, and the character knows it. For example, if he could have saved someone by adding an attribute bonus, but he couldn't because he was scared.
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