Zed's Magic Thread

[jamesrbrown]

Zed, that's an impressive amount of work and beautiful too! I began reading awhile ago, but I will download the latest and have a look. Thanks for creating and putting so much love into your work. It makes it even more enjoyable.

[zedturtle]

The art you're using is spectacular. Great choices!

Zed, that's an impressive amount of work and beautiful too! I began reading awhile ago, but I will download the latest and have a look. Thanks for creating and putting so much love into your work. It makes it even more enjoyable.

Thanks to both of you for your kind comments.

Please let me know if you find any typos or points of concern; I'm sure these rules aren't perfect.

[Tantavalist]

Excellent work!

Most magic systems that people try to make magic rules for Tolkein RPGs in any system tend to fail at capturing the feel of the source material and just look like a generic fantasy RPG spell system. There was a set of magic rules in Issue 13 of the Other Minds webzine, but while it was a very nice fit for the background and atmosphere the writer clearly lacked a proper grasp of the TOR rules and how they were supposed to balance.

This ruleset here seems to be both balanced in terms of the rules, and conveys an authentic Middle-Earth feel. Well done!

That said, the OM13 rules are still worth a glance. I'd be tempted to have some of the spells (the non-broken ones) be available as extras for users of Zed's system to learn. Heart of the Wild already gives someone who masters Elf-Magic the ability to learn even more spells from Ormal the Lampmaker (HotW p79-80), and he'd surely not the only one who could teach unique magics.

[zedturtle]

Thanks for all the nice words. As mentioned in the rules, they're not supposed to be comprehensive, so adding stuff is completely cool. It's all up to what a Loremaster wants in their game.

[poosticks7]

I will add to your praises Zed - Impressive work indeed, you really have captured the theme of magic well in your document and the document looks lovely as well.

Good stuff.

[Robin Smallburrow]

looks good Zed - will download and read when I get a chance - feedback after that!

Robin S.

[Robin Smallburrow]

Very Good Zed!

I especially like your idea of Shadow Tests for adversaries (consider it purloined!) - can't believe no-one else thought of it.

I do think you are missing one possibly two Arts, however: The Art of Weather/Water or Air, Storm & Water - ie magic dealing with wind, water & weather:

Boromir: : "they say in my land that he [Sauron] can govern the storms above the nameless mountains on the borders of his land"

Examples would include Rain-Ward, Cold-Ward, Fog-raising etc. There is also the example of Luthien summoning a Mist of Speed to conceal her & Beren from sight.

Robin S.

[zedturtle]

Very Good Zed!

I especially like your idea of Shadow Tests for adversaries (consider it purloined!) - can't believe no-one else thought of it.

I do think you are missing one possibly two Arts, however: The Art of Weather/Water or Air, Storm & Water - ie magic dealing with wind, water & weather:

Boromir: : "they say in my land that he [Sauron] can govern the storms above the nameless mountains on the borders of his land"

Examples would include Rain-Ward, Cold-Ward, Fog-raising etc. There is also the example of Luthien summoning a Mist of Speed to conceal her & Beren from sight.

Robin S.

Ooh! Good point... I will have a think about that, and perhaps I can find the room to include it. Other than Sauron/Saruman (his arm has grown long indeed) and Luthien, do we have any other canonical weather workings?

[zedturtle]

I'm spending some time this weekend updating and expanding this project... mostly to add in my alternate rules for personal Eye Awareness, which I think would help with using these rules in more experienced companies.

Also, I'm thinking about adding in something along the line of Robin's suggested weather magic.

[zedturtle]

I've got a bit more room, and I'm struggling to expand my thoughts on:

Who Can Learn Magic?

This is a decision that each Loremaster will have to make, in order to to preserve what their group feels is the proper aproach to Middle Earth. One of the more restrictive approaches might be that only those hallowed by the Valar are capable of working magic for good. This not only covers the Istari like Gandalf, Saruman, and Radagast, but could also include folks like Beorn, Galadriel, and Celembrimbor. Some heroes might be included in this list as well.

But it also seems like there are others who can work magic (like the men of Dale, Denethor and others in Gondor) who might not receive the blessing of the Valar, at least directly. Perhaps those peoples are utilising magics that are more inherent to Middle Earth than Valinor. In any case, Loremasters should use the source texts as examples of what is possible and not a complete listing of the only way that magic can be done.

I'm sure that there's a more elegant way of saying this... what I want to say is that you should look at what we see in the books as examples of magic, but not fundamental rules on how all magic in Middle Earth works. It seems (in my admittedly generous reading of the texts) that there's an implication of a lot more magic out there than what Frodo and company see, it's just not relevant to the story at hand.

How best to explain that?