Zed's Magic Thread

[zedturtle]

Wow! Well made.

Thanks! It's certainly interesting to see as a physical object that you can actually turn the pages of instead of just on the screen. The booklet has been hanging out next to Laketown all day, just because.

[Falenthal]

It's precious, Zed. Really.

It makes me want to introduce magic in my games just to use it

I'll give it another read now that this version is out.
Thanks for sharing.

[fast.git]

This looks fantastic!

[zedturtle]

It's precious, Zed. Really.

It makes me want to introduce magic in my games just to use it

I'll give it another read now that this version is out.
Thanks for sharing.

This looks fantastic!

Thanks! Please let me know what you think... feedback is always highly appreciated, and helps me become better.

[Falenthal]

Hey, Zed, I'm probably a bit late, but I'm re-reading your document in this days (as much as I can, with two children on vacation from school...).

I'll try to post the small things that I can see in the document that leave me thinking for some reason.

p.4

The Hunt Threshold
may modified as indicated on page 114 of Rivendell

A "be" is needed between "may" and "modified", right?

p.5

Moving between different regions. Each time the
heroes enter a region of higher difficulty (as shown
on page 158 of the revised rulebook) than the one
they started the Adventuring Phase in, they increase
their Eye Awareness by one.

I like the idea, but shouldn't it be "from a region to another with a higher difficulty"?
Is it your intention that, if a party starts an Adventuring Phase in, let's say, a Dark Land, they'll never increase Eye Awareness during that Adventure?

p.6

The Hidden Place
Given sufficient time to prepare a small area, you may
use your arts to make that place hard to find for others.

What is "sufficient time" for you? Maybe you don't need a rule like "30 minutes for every 5m square", but something like "one hour for a campsite, one day for a cottage" could work.

p.9 The Way of Healing

I should see this Practices in play, but they look too weak to me, at least by reading them.
I'm not very good at seeing the importance of rules by just reading them (unlike Glorelendil or Angelalex), but here's what I think:
Battle Leech-craft: A dying companion has 12 hours to recover, right? There's no need to stabilise him during battle, as far as I can see. Maybe allowing an Unconscious character recover as many Endurance points as the caster's Wisdom (enough to stand up again, but probably just bare to sustain another hit) could be a nice effect.

The Easing of Pain: I am not very happy with tying the recovery with Body: Hobbits will always profit less from this, and Beornings/Dwarves more. Maybe Body or Heart? Or, again, relate the recovery to the caster, not to the character. The Wisdom of the caster, or his Heart, or his Wits (Elves and Woodmen make for the best healers).
And, if the extra Endurance allows to recover from the Weary or the Wounded state, why don't you allow it? Just asking.

The Hands of the Healer:

The wound
now counts as treated.

Shouldn't this "wound" begin with a capital W?

The effect is just the same as using the Healing skill, right? Maybe a bit weak? Usually every group has someone with a decent Healing skill, so this Practice might become useless or unnecessary.
I think it would be nice to affect Poison, since you need the weapon that inflicted the Wound.
And it could be used to stabilize a Dying companion even if a prior Healing test was failed during the same day.


That's all I've read and thought of for today. Let's see when I'll have time for something more.

By the way, I'll repeat myself, but the art and design of the document is enchanting.
And I like a lot how you envision magic in Middle-Earth.

[Falenthal]

One more...

p.10 Hound's Swiftness

I like it as is, but I was thinking that something like being allowed to skip the Athletic's test when Forcing the March or something like that (or reducing the TN of the Athletic's test) could also be in flavour with the quote and the name of the Practice.
Or simply reduce by 1 the Fatigue gained by every Travel+Athletics test when Forcing March.

But that would be different from the Hunting theme, I fear.

[Falenthal]

And...

p.11 The Guiding Light

The light will last until the next
prolonged rest period, after which it must be recast.

Isn't it too long? Maybe the effect could last for one Scene (one Combat, one Encounter, one Travel leg,...).

p.11 The Shadow Test
I guess the Shadwo Test is design to, usually, be failed by the Shadow creatures, right?
Otherwise, it needs a very powerful adversary against a weak hero to succeed (unless an Eye is rolled).
On the other hand, why not try to stick to the usual rule of "make players do the rolling"? The caster could do a Wisdom test with a TN of 10 (or 8 if you want it to be easier) + Attribute level of the adversary. Hope points can be used to improve the outcome of the roll.

p.11
A Commanding Voice

I can't see the difference between using this Practice and using the Persuade skill. Am I missing something? Only the fact that you don't need to roll? Then it's too similar to a Trait for my taste. I think it should be a bit more powerful.

p.12 The Knowing Mind

Acting on the knowledge gained from this spell may
cause Corruption Tests or even an automatic point of
Shadow if used for evil intent.

Using it to know if an Adversary is going to use a Special Ability or something like that, in order to kill it easier, is considered an "evil intent"? I think whatever you decide, it should be specified.

The Truthful Gaze
Again, as is, seems like the same as an Insight test [see Commanding Voice]

In general terms, I think that "The Way of Men" should be a second tier Way, one that needs the mastery of another Way to be learned (like Way of the Fire or Way of Command). And then, it should be a little more powerful... and more dangerous towards Shadow gain. Mastery of another's mind is in the limits of Sorcery.

p.12

Noble Mien
Note that
some beings of immense age and experience (such as
a Dragon, a Wizard or certain Noldor) may see the
glamour for what it is and dismiss it.

This exceptions should be specified, I think. NPCs with an Attribute level higher than the caster's Wisdom? Or with some special ability? I can't come with any specific criteria right now, sorry...

p.13
Silent Speech

The number of
participants is limited to no more than the Wisdom
rating of the participant with the lowest Wisdom score

I'd add a +1 to the Wisdom rating. Otherwise, if someone has a Wisdom of 1 (quite possible), only the caster can speak... and noone else can listen.

Tongue of the Heart

lf
the participants in an Encounter represent two or more
distinct Backgrounds,...

Why Backgrounds? I would see Races (or Cultures) as a more "middle-earthish" theme for this Practice. Besides, we don't have Backgrounds for NPCs, but we do have their Race.

p.14

Circle of Wrath~
With this spell, you may become like to a terror to
your enemies. To cast this spell, you must forfeit your
preliminary Battle roll and any Opening Volleys you
would be eligible for. ln combat, an adversary must first
pass a Shadow Test (see page 11) in order to engage you.
Once that particular opponent has succeeded, it may
continue to attack you without further penalty.

This Practice seems egoistic for the rest of the Company: they don't get the benefit of your Bonus die, any harm you could do during Opening Volleys, and they get to engage the adversaries you're scaring!
If it benefited the whole group, it would be more profitable for everyone.

p-14
Guarding and Guiding

Once per Journey, if the number of Gandalf runes equals
or exceeds the number ofSauron runes, you may ask the
loremaster to negate the Hazard that would have been
faced by the company.

Why not allow, for one leg of a Journey, Gandalfs to negate Eyes?
Otherwise, I think the description should be changed: "to negate the Hazard". What if more than one Hazard was triggered? You mean "negate just one Hazard if Gandalfs exceed Eyes"? Or "negate one Eye for every Gandalf only if Gandalfs exceed in total the Eyes"?

p.15
A Fair Wind

whomever is the beneficiary of the spell is considered to
have a bonus die for their roll.

Why not the whole party. It seems better connected with the quote. After all it affects just one roll for one Fatigue test.

[Falenthal]

Well, in the end I was able to read the whole document when less expected .

Consider everything I said as suggestions and points to think of. I haven't tested anything, so they're just impressions.

Something that came to mind while reading it is that magic in Middle-Earth seems to be tied to the Sun and Night cycle: Sorceries are dispelled by the sun, and some "good" spells are said to be profitable "while the Sun shines".

Could be a good addition to a magic system... if only we knew how without making it very cumbersome.

[Falenthal]

Something that came to mind while reading it is that magic in Middle-Earth seems to be tied to the Sun and Night cycle: Sorceries are dispelled by the sun, and some "good" spells are said to be profitable "while the Sun shines".

Could be a good addition to a magic system... if only we knew how without making it very cumbersome.

First approach:

"Every spell cast that grants one or more Shadow points, is considered Sorcery. As such, its effects dispel if touched by the Sun's light."

"Adversaries with the Denizen of the Dark ability see their Attribute level doubled for the purpouse of resisting or confronting a Practice if in the dark (night, underground,...)."

The last one could be a reason to keep Shadow tests in the hands of the Adversaries, as only rolls made by them are affected by the Denizen of the Dark ability.

[zedturtle]

w00t! Great stuff, more than I can respond to via my phone, but all points will be considered for the new version.