Using Forced March with Revised Travel

[doctheweasel]

Tales from Wilderland has some forced march rules in the Kinslaying adventure. They allow you to half your travel time if you make an Athletics check after your standard Fatigue check.
Failure gains 2 fatigue
Success gains 1 fatigue
Great/Extraordinary Success gains 0.

These rules were written with the original travel rules in mind (where failure gained fewer fatigue points). I was considering using this with the Revised rule set, but wonder if the fatigue gain should be increased to more closely match the fatigue lost in the new system.

My proposed change:
Failure gains 3 fatigue
Success gains 2 fatigue
Great Success gains 1 fatigue
Extraordinary Success gains 0

Does this seem too harsh, not harsh enough, or just right to you all? Does the original work well enough, or is this change warranted?

[Deadmanwalking]

Having just played through this bit...I think potentially 4 Fatigue per set of tests is plenty. I mean, a few bad rolls and we're talking a lot of Fatigue.

[Michebugio]

I would keep those rules the same, since you would essentially double the penalties for traveling. A character could potentially gain 5 Fatigue if both his Travel AND Athletics check fail, which is an awful lot, and with your rules you would bring that up to 6.

[Glorelendil]

Having recently played a character with a Fatigue score well above his maximum endurance, I will observe that beyond a certain point...an easily reached point...a "lot" of Fatigue gain is functionally indistinguishable from "some" fatigue gain. You're gonna be Weary for the rest of the adventure either way.

So I wouldn't worry too much whether 0-2 or 0-3 is the right range. Forced marches easily pile on so many points that I don't think its a big distinction.

[Tantavalist]

I'd suggest the following...

When Forced Marching, all fellowship members automatically gain additional fatigue equal to their Travel Gear weight when testing for Travel fatigue. Each PC makes an Athletics roll, and adjusts the extra fatigue based on the level of success.

Failure means no reduction.

Success reduces it by one.

Great Success reduces it by two.

Extraordinary Success reduces it by three.

This means that it will work as per the original rules in Spring and Summer, and as doctheweasel's amended version during Autumn or Winter. I like this version because anyone trying to do a forced march in winter should most definitely be punished for it.

[Falenthal]

I'd suggest the following...

When Forced Marching, all fellowship members automatically gain additional fatigue equal to their Travel Gear weight when testing for Travel fatigue. Each PC makes an Athletics roll, and adjusts the extra fatigue based on the level of success.

Failure means no reduction.

Success reduces it by one.

Great Success reduces it by two.

Extraordinary Success reduces it by three.

This means that it will work as per the original rules in Spring and Summer, and as doctheweasel's amended version during Autumn or Winter. I like this version because anyone trying to do a forced march in winter should most definitely be punished for it.

I think I like this option. For me, Forced March must be hard on the heroes, and there should be a high chance of becoming Weary. I don't know about your experience, but in my game those Twice Baked Honey Cakes are making my heroes almost inmune to Travel Fatigue. Add the Preliminary Rolls on top of them and they should be going to Mordor to fear any kind of Travel.

[Majestic]

My group doesn't have any Twice-baked honey cakes. The one Beorning player is rarely able to make it to the table (and hasn't picked TBHC yet), so it hasn't been an option for them. So Travel can be quite tough.

I just went with the rules from Tales when they've done forced marches, but I hadn't really considered that those rules were made for the 'old' travel system.

I kind of like the idea of upping things by 1 across the board, personally.

[Deadmanwalking]

I think I like this option. For me, Forced March must be hard on the heroes, and there should be a high chance of becoming Weary. I don't know about your experience, but in my game those Twice Baked Honey Cakes are making my heroes almost inmune to Travel Fatigue. Add the Preliminary Rolls on top of them and they should be going to Mordor to fear any kind of Travel.

Speaking as the player of a Beorning with Twice-Baked Honey Cakes (plus Athletics 3 and Travel 2)...I gained 8 Fatigue while doing the Forced March in Kin Strife.

Admittedly, I rolled poorly (especially on the Travel tests)...but I was hardly alone in doing so. The Dwarf did fine, but he's got Travel 3, as well as Stiff Neck of the Dwarves and 5 Shadow...and even he gained something like 3 Fatigue out of the deal.

So...I'm not sure modifications of the Forced March rules are necessary. They seem to handle the brutality of doing that pretty well.

Now, if talking about Travel tests in general, you're probably right to some extent, but even there, people fail rolls. Not all the time or anything, but it happens, even with the Honey Cakes helping out. Believe me, the Company in the game I'm in have wound up Weary or perilously close to it from Travel alone far too often for me to feel it's an 'I Win' button. At Wisdom 3-4, it's about as good as another die of Travel, which means people with Travel 3+ aren't gonna fail often, but that's true of people with Travel 4 anyway...it just lowers the 'we don't need to worry about this too much' threshold by a point of Travel, which, while cool, doesn't seem the end of the world.

By the real endgame with Wisdom 6 and Travel 4, sure, it's pretty much never gonna fail...but by that point shouldn't getting tired from travel be more the exception than the rule?

[Michebugio]

Having recently played a character with a Fatigue score well above his maximum endurance, I will observe that beyond a certain point...an easily reached point...a "lot" of Fatigue gain is functionally indistinguishable from "some" fatigue gain. You're gonna be Weary for the rest of the adventure either way.

Wait, wait. I believe that this is not possible by the RAW, i.e. the maximum Fatigue a character can have is equal to his maximum Endurance. Or am I wrong?

[Majestic]

Having recently played a character with a Fatigue score well above his maximum endurance, I will observe that beyond a certain point...an easily reached point...a "lot" of Fatigue gain is functionally indistinguishable from "some" fatigue gain. You're gonna be Weary for the rest of the adventure either way.

Wait, wait. I believe that this is not possible by the RAW, i.e. the maximum Fatigue a character can have is equal to his maximum Endurance. Or am I wrong?

I just went through every usage of the word 'Fatigue' in the rules, and I don't see that it says that anywhere. If a player wanted to be continually Weary, I don't see why they couldn't.