Defensive Stance - Defend ally

[daddystabz]

If you want to protect an ally while in defensive stance and are willing to spend the point of Hope to do so do you still get to attack on your turn also? If not and your buddy does not get attacked you gave up your turn for nothing. Seems odd.

[Valarian]

I run it as the character still gets their attack in if the player hasn't used up the Defend Ally ability. Defence stance players go after the other melee stances. I see the Defend Ally combat task as a background task rather than the active speech or intimidation of the other two stances. They pick a player they're sticking close to and can choose to take the damage. If they do, they lose their attack. If they don't they can still attack when their turn comes in the initiative.

[Woodclaw]

If you want to protect an ally while in defensive stance and are willing to spend the point of Hope to do so do you still get to attack on your turn also? If not and your buddy does not get attacked you gave up your turn for nothing. Seems odd.

I can't find it right now, but I remember there was a post where Francesco noted that heroes doing the Defend Ally task could still attack - opposed to many other tasks.

[Hermes Serpent]

Here's my note of the comment by Francesco.
Mar 1 2012
Intimidate Foe: yes, intimidating requires to forfeit your attack.

Rally Comrades: forfeit as above.

Protect Companion: you don't forfeit your attack. Spend Hope and be attacked in place of the character you protect.

Prepare shot: forfeit, as you spend the round doing nothing but aim.

Francesco

JamesRBrown posted:
"but what about Escape Combat?"
The rules say, "Companions engaged in close combat may attempt to escape when their turn to act comes." Then, "At the end of a combat round spent fighting in a close combat stance, a player-hero may attempt to escape the field by making a roll of Athletics." Which is it? "When their turn to act comes?" Or "at the end of a combat round spent fighting?"

Francesco responded:
The rule should have been similar for both instances (hero in Rearward and hero in any close combat stance), with a companion being allowed to flee (or try to) at the beginning of a round following a round of combat.

- If you fought the previous round in rearward, you may escape automatically at the beginning of your following round.

- If you fought the previous round in any close combat stance, you may attempt to escape at the beginning of your following round by making a roll of Athletics, etc.

[Cawdorthane]

We certainly play that on the plain reading of the rules, you do not lose your attack when you opt to defend ally, but you must spend the point of Hope before the adversary rolls his attack.....

cheers
Mark

[Glorelendil]

We certainly play that on the plain reading of the rules, you do not lose your attack when you opt to defend ally, but you must spend the point of Hope before the adversary rolls his attack.....

cheers
Mark

That does seem to be RAW, but it bothers me: usually when you spend a point of Hope it is for a known, guaranteed outcome. That seems to be how the Hope mechanic is constructed. But spending a point of Hope only to have the enemy miss your companion is a wasted point.

I think I would house rule that you don't spend the point if the attack misses.

[doctheweasel]

We certainly play that on the plain reading of the rules, you do not lose your attack when you opt to defend ally, but you must spend the point of Hope before the adversary rolls his attack.....

cheers
Mark

That does seem to be RAW, but it bothers me: usually when you spend a point of Hope it is for a known, guaranteed outcome. That seems to be how the Hope mechanic is constructed. But spending a point of Hope only to have the enemy miss your companion is a wasted point.

I think I would house rule that you don't spend the point if the attack misses.

It is a guaranteed outcome: your ally is not going to be hit no matter what the roll is.

[SirKicley]

I play as you do Elf-Crusher.

Player chooses Defensive Stance. The round commences through the other stances, it comes time for the Defensive Stance guy to act, he attacks and indicates he'll "take the hit" for a fellow.

LM attacks protected fellow. LM misses - no harm no foul. LM hits - defender leaps to the defense, knocking the fellow out of harms way, or in some other way disrupting the attack. Hope Spent. Damage avoided.


Robert

[Cawdorthane]

Naturally if the rule as written does not appeal to particular LM's and their players, that's their call on what house rules they apply. I personally think it fits the element of self sacrifice aspect inherent in this tactic better to play it as written, that the companion throwing himself/herself in front of a friend does not know the extent of the risk. It is particularly useful to protect a Fellowship Focus in forward or open stance and I suspect it could be open to gamey play if the point of Hope could be spent after the adversary's roll was known. But as I say, there is a always individual choice open to LM's as to how strictly they apply the rules - if your players are laughing and engaged or on occasion caught up in the rising tension as the drama unfolds, then whatever you are doing is working!

cheers
Mark

[Shieldmaiden]

I'm glad this discussion happened, because I think it's going to make for a really useful tactic in my game and I probably would have forgotten to emphasise that you don't give up your attack to use it. The Beorning in the company is going to be absolutely devastating with his great spear, but he's very vulnerable to attack (low parry, low armour) and there are several characters with high parry scores and/or lots of armour who would do well to protect him. Funnily enough, one of them is a Hobbit.