Designing your own Adversaries

[Falenthal]

Everyone can be defeated, but of course some are harder than others. And a Great Orc is ment to be the like of the Great Goblin, or Azog or Bolg. They are chieftains that don't come out for a stroll alone, and are probably not to be used as a standard combat in TOR. One Great Orc per campaign is probably enough, and it could be one of those enemies that runs before they die, only to appear later in the story.

[Halbarad]

I don’t know if the position was ever clarified in 2Ed but this caused quite a lengthy conversation back in the depths of time, when the slipcase edition was released.

IIRC it was accepted that a creature becomes Weary once it’s Endurance reaches Zero. This means that all Protection Rolls it makes ignore the 1,2,3. Makes your opponent a lot less impenetrable for Wounds.

Even if it was never adopted as official, it’s a reasonable house rule imo.

As I prefer a quite Heroic game, I also make Creatures spend Hate to add their Attribute Level to their Armour and suchlike. It mirrors the expenditure of Hope among the Heroes and doesn’t break the game(though it does make Combat a little less perilous if the characters can survive the first few rounds of combat).

I guess the appropriate tactic in the above circumstances is to fight aggressively in Forward Stance. Great Orcs and Trolls and the like have so many dice and bonus Shadow Abilities that the chances are they will hit and hit hard in the early rounds, no matter your stance. Maximise your chances to hit your opponent and inflict maximum damage early on.

Another possibility is to Called Shot: Disarm on their main weapon, effectively dropping their ability to injure your character.

[Timmity Took]

... and it could be one of those enemies that runs before they die, only to appear later in the story.

Yes, good point. And after gamemastering for 20 years I think I would do that, but would beginners know to do that? I don't remember if the combat examples cover roleplaying foes and making choices like that during combat or plan it in advance... oh well, no biggie (except the great orc).

[Timmity Took]

I don’t know if the position was ever clarified in 2Ed but this caused quite a lengthy conversation back in the depths of time, when the slipcase edition was released.

IIRC it was accepted that a creature becomes Weary once it’s Endurance reaches Zero. This means that all Protection Rolls it makes ignore the 1,2,3. Makes your opponent a lot less impenetrable for Wounds.

...
As I prefer a quite Heroic game, I also make Creatures spend Hate to add their Attribute Level to their Armour and suchlike. It mirrors the expenditure of Hope among the Heroes and doesn’t break the game(though it does make Combat a little less perilous if the characters can survive the first few rounds of combat).
...
Another possibility is to Called Shot: Disarm on their main weapon, effectively dropping their ability to injure your character.

Yes it is offocial in the corebook, they get weary.

Adversaries automatically add attribute to favoured skills, favoured weapons and favoured armour.
I get why you might allow them to invoke attributes on non-favoured skills, but I like to use that on special abilities and to resisting the companion's atempts to intimidate them... But maybe I'll try it. Thanks for the tip.

Just reading the Called Shot rules, they always seemed so underpowered and costly to me. They payoff didn't seem to mach the risk. Needing to hit AND getting a 6 on the success dice to make it or to hit at all, and really messing up if you miss... Never seemed worth it to me.
But it is?

[Otaku-sempai]

Are there foes in this game that aren't meant to be defearable in combat, but has to be overcome in other ways or just avoided?
As I said, I am new to combat in this system.

Yes, a party, especially an inexperienced company, might well come across adversaries that are too powerful to overcome alone and should not confront unless there is no other choice. The Balrog of Moria. A fully mature and experienced Dragon; the Witch-king or several Nazgûl together. The Great Orc is unlikely to appear without some sort of retinue (such as the bodyguards of Bolg). The Thing in the Well from "Don't Leave the Path!" (Tales from Wilderland) is intended to be one such example.

Even an experience group is likely to have to make some hard choices when faced with a powerful foe: sneak away to report and fight another day; fight though it probably means a tpk; one or two Heroes hold the line, allowing the rest to escape; etc. One thing that seems to happen often is that a group of companions forget or ignore their primary mission in order to confront a foe best left for another day.

[atgxtg]

Some adversaries are meant to be defeated by more experienced heroes, or by a group of them. 4D isn't invulnerable.
Plus, the game isn't necessarily about fighting the monsters the way a game like D&D often is.

That is why a LM should be careful about what sort of foes he puts into an adventure. Smaug is not something that even the most powerful of heroes in Middle Earth can tackle head on and expect to win.

[Timmity Took]

4D isn't invulnerable.

No, but favoured armour 4D with 7 attribute and Great size can be pretty close. Right?

[Timmity Took]

I just realized that protection dice are affected by weary too!
....
My bad

[Halbarad]

Yep, that’s what I was trying to convey.

Also, that I make the Creatures pay in Hate to invoke attribute bonuses on favoured skills and armour, not the regular ones. It isn’t automatically added on in my game.

[Timmity Took]

Also, that I make the Creatures pay in Hate to invoke attribute bonuses on favoured skills and armour, not the regular ones. It isn’t automatically added on in my game.

I see. I don't think I'll do that in my game. I think the deadly dangerous combats and the way the combat rules are designed is a good fit for the system and the world they are trying to emulate. Making adversaries use their relatively few hate points for that in addition to spending them on special abilities and as "endurance" against intimidation and fear, among a few other things.. well, I feel that weakens or limits them a bit too much and makes for a very different combat experience.

Don't get me wrong, I love cinematic and heroic, even super-heroic combat in other systems and settings
If I wanted to emulate the movies, I might want to go for that here too. Or I might even use another system all together.