What attribute level would a Balrog be?

nazgul_2000 · Post by **nazgul_2000** » Wed Mar 12, 2014 3:37 am

Or would he simply be off the charts?

From what I can gather, the highest attribute level out there is the Cold Drake from Adventures in Wilderland, and he's all alone at level 10. The next lowest includes a nasty spider in Mirkwood, and then mountain trolls. I can't imagine that a mountain troll would be more terrible than a Balrog. What do you guys think? More powerful than a Cold Drake, or equal to?

Note: I don't have Darkening of Mirkwood yet.

Beran · Post by **Beran** » Wed Mar 12, 2014 3:58 am

Well, given the Nazgul are 4-5 (which I think is woefully underpowered) I would say a Balrog (RAW) would be 9-10. However, I feel they would have to open a whole new door for this monster.

Angelalex242 · Post by **Angelalex242** » Wed Mar 12, 2014 4:34 am

The max attribute level allowable in the Loremaster guide is 12.

So the Balrog has a 12. Sauron himself also has a 12. Which kinda makes sense, they're both Maia of Morgoth.

Glorelendil · Post by **Glorelendil** » Wed Mar 12, 2014 5:21 am

Angelalex242 wrote:The max attribute level allowable in the Loremaster guide is 12.

So the Balrog has a 12. Sauron himself also has a 12. Which kinda makes sense, they're both Maia of Morgoth.

Angel and I agree on something.

A Balrog is certainly more powerful than any living dragon at this point.

EDIT: As for the Nazgul, the consensus seems to be that their physical power is limited at this point, but will be much greater by the time the War rolls around. And it's their non-physical powers that are most dangerous.

Beran · Post by **Beran** » Wed Mar 12, 2014 5:37 am

How are the Special abilities something to fear? Reading them it seems most Companions that have a little experience will be able to with stand their use. They are mainly Fear, Corruption and Valour checks at a max of 3 points higher then the default TN of 14. Combine that with their near human physical stats they are, IMO, almost laughable as the creatures of pure terror they are supposed to be. At least on paper any way. Yeah, I get it Sauron isn't at his full power and so his Lieutenants aren't either. But, even a weakened Nazgul should be something to fear. The ones listed in the DoM fall flat from what I can see. Perhaps, I am wrong and I will eventually find out as I am running a PbP game of DoM right now. As long as the game lasts long enough that is.

Anywho, off topic.

Glorelendil · Post by **Glorelendil** » Wed Mar 12, 2014 6:07 am

Beran wrote:How are the Special abilities something to fear? Reading them it seems most Companions that have a little experience will be able to with stand their use. They are mainly Fear, Corruption and Valour checks at a max of 3 points higher then the default TN of 14. Combine that with their near human physical stats they are, IMO, almost laughable as the creatures of pure terror they are supposed to be. At least on paper any way. Yeah, I get it Sauron isn't at his full power and so his Lieutenants aren't either. But, even a weakened Nazgul should be something to fear. The ones listed in the DoM fall flat from what I can see. Perhaps, I am wrong and I will eventually find out as I am running a PbP game of DoM right now. As long as the game lasts long enough that is.

Anywho, off topic.

Haven't LM'd them yet so can't say. But I can see how their attribute level could be low at this point.

Angelalex242 · Post by **Angelalex242** » Wed Mar 12, 2014 7:59 am

Well, if it were me, the Witch King would have attribute 10, the others would have attribute 9, and their valor and corruption tests would be TN 20 for the Witch King and TN 18 for the others.

Yusei · Post by **Yusei** » Wed Mar 12, 2014 9:05 am

Beran wrote:But, even a weakened Nazgul should be something to fear.

Black Breath is scary. They get one for free, and then they can use it ten times! If there are two nazguls, they can use it twice a turn, at least 20 times, and the TN in increased. Half the party could easily get unconcious quickly, and then be Miserable even if woken up. They'd better have a high Wisdom.

Of course, they can also turn some heros weary if they fail a Fear test, so they'd better have a high Valour too. Can you imagine being weary and daunted in that fight?

So, sure, Nazguls are not particularly good fighters, but it seems their strength lie in weakening their opponents.

Tolkien said in a letter:

Tolkien wrote:"They have no great physical power against the fearless, but what they have, and the fear that they inspire, is enormously increased in darkness"

Beran · Post by **Beran** » Wed Mar 12, 2014 12:42 pm

Angelalex242 wrote:Well, if it were me, the Witch King would have attribute 10, the others would have attribute 9, and their valor and corruption tests would be TN 20 for the Witch King and TN 18 for the others.

I can agree with that.

Stormcrow · Post by **Stormcrow** » Wed Mar 12, 2014 1:17 pm

The Nazgul only have power in darkness and loneliness. They cannot just storm the bright, crowded inn at Bree; they must stalk the Ringbearer in the wilderness.

As such, the Nazguls' middling Attribute level, combined with Denizen of the Dark, is an excellent arrangement to describe them properly.

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