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Antonyms of noun courtesy

1 of 3 senses of courtesy


Sense 3:
courtesy, good manners
Antonym of discourtesy (Sense 2)
=>discourtesy, rudeness


Well, the thesaurus pretty clearly says a lack of courtesy is simply rudeness.
So theoretically, anyone with 0 courtesy is licensed to be a jerk to people.

The key mistake you're making is assuming 0 courtesy doesn't also apply to your own race. It does. Rolling courtesy against the elven king if you're an elf doesn't give you extra dice to roll. You still get 0.

So by rights, anyone with 0 courtesy should never say please and thank you, and should theoretically be docked for bad RP if ever they accidentally DO say please and thank you.

Angelalex242 wrote:Antonyms of noun courtesy
Sense 3:
courtesy, good manners
Antonym of discourtesy (Sense 2)
=>discourtesy, rudeness

Well, the thesaurus pretty clearly says a lack of courtesy is simply rudeness.
So theoretically, anyone with 0 courtesy is licensed to be a jerk to people.

Actually, rudeness is either deliberate, inadvertent, or inferred. Let's say you're visiting a Beorning village in the highlands. The Headman presents you with an obsidian dagger. Everyone knows when a highland Beorning gives a gift, the person receiving the gift is supposed to reciprocate and the more dear the reciprocating gift is, the better it is received.

You, no stranger to the highlands, have a 5 courtesy. And unfortunately you are wearing your best clothes and gear so you decide to just thank the headman for the gift. You are being deliberately rude to the headman and you know it and all present know it. You have a 5 courtesy and you are being jerk.

On the other hand you could have 0 courtesy, and profusely thank the headman, sincerely telling him this is the best dagger you've ever seen, you'll cherish it forever, etc, etc... but, you don't give him a gift because you don't know you're suppose to. Even if you'd just given your crappy dagger in return everything would be smoothed over. But you didn't, so the headman and all present conclude you are nothing but a lout (because they assume everyone knows when a highland Beorning gives a gift, etc etc.)

So by rights, anyone with 0 courtesy should never say please and thank you, and should theoretically be docked for bad RP if ever they accidentally DO say please and thank you.

IMO, a 0 courtesy only indicates you weren't raised or instructed properly on how to interact as per the customs of the society in question. It doesn't mean you're going out of your way to swearing at women and young children every chance you get.

You don't need to use a thesaurus to defend your interpretation of the rules; you are free to play however you want to.

I like my interpretation; it makes more sense to me. Your interpretation would make "courtesy" the only common skill that is really an attitude, as opposed to a "skill".

I suspect "Etiquette" or "Protocol" is more what Francesco had in mind when he created that skill, but "courtesy" is a more tolkien-esque word.

P.S. And ignorance of social norms could easily extend to your own culture/race, especially when dealing with the king. If somebody doesn't know which fork to use at a fancy dinner, are they rude or just uninformed?

Yes, Evening. Precisely.

Mirkwood Elves get a "0" for Courtesy; however, they are relatively unsophisticated. Lorien Elves might also receive a "0" or they might get an "1". Rivendell Elves might even receive a "2" for Courtesy.

Angelalex242 wrote: So by rights, anyone with 0 courtesy should never say please and thank you, and should theoretically be docked for bad RP if ever they accidentally DO say please and thank you.

This "logic" continues to annoy me.


If you have zero riddle skill and you answer somebody's question indirectly, but without lying, should you be docked for bad RP?

What if you have zero weapon skill and you try to use that weapon anyway? Shockingly bad RP, right?

Is the inverse also true? If you have high "Awe" skill and you decide not to use it on somebody, should you be docked for bad RP?

What if you have high Persuade and you decide to just go with the flow when your fellowship wants to do something you don't agree with? Bad RP?

I realize (or hope) you were being a little bit facetious about actually docking for bad RP, but equating a skill, or the absence of a skill, with fixed personality traits is, ironically, the only bad RP I see going on here.

Quietly wondering if it's ok to return to the original topic?

Could there be a problem with the generality of theme keywords? A theme like "Intrigue" could be used in many, many ways, so I guess it would have to be the call of the Loremaster in the end if invoking the theme is ok?