The Shire the most modern place in ME?

[Tolwen]

There is another aspect to consider. Apart from the "internal" approaches to the problem (finding ways to explain the different phenomena within Middle-earth as done exemplary in the previous post by Otaku-sempai), you have to consider the "external" as well.
Originally, The Hobbit was not written and designed for Middle-earth (i.e. Tolkien's beloved Silmarillion world). Only later, when his publisher asked for a sequel (which became the LotR), did Tolkien integrate it into this world. This was done only superficially (and as a slight modification of the finished book) for several reasons.
But as a bottom line, Tolkien was not thinking of his Silmarillion world (which was his primary interest for decades) as a backdrop when he wrote The Hobbit and thus made the Shire more into a cozy place of an idealised 19th century rural England which he so loved rather than a small place of the Sil-world in later times.

It would be interesting to see what would have become of all these small and nice anachronisms like umbrellas, postal services or clocks if Tolkien would really have a done a fundamental revision of the book as was planned IIRC.

In the end, thus you can see these bits as the result of The Hobbit (and thus these peculiarities of the Shire and its people) being integrated into the greater Middle-earth myth and history only as an afterthought by the author - the "external" explanation for this questions as mentioned in the beginning.

How one deals with this is another matter of course.

Cheers
Tolwen

[zedturtle]

The archives in Gondor may count as a museum of a sort.

But I think some people are missing Rocmistro's point: Messenger services certainly exist in Gondor, all it takes is a piece of paper, a man and a horse. But they are almost certainly in service to the state (for the benefit of the Stewards and the military), not accessible to the common person.

That's what I was (very inarticulately) trying to get at... the Shire works the way it does because of the population's attitudes and peaceful nature. Making an archive is not unknown to Gondor; but making it available to everyone sure is.

I'm not sure about Numenoreans being lawyers; it was the Blessed Realm, after all. I seem to recall something about a high place and eagles being sent by Manwë to perch in judgement...

[Southron]

The archives in Gondor may count as a museum of a sort.

But I think some people are missing Rocmistro's point: Messenger services certainly exist in Gondor, all it takes is a piece of paper, a man and a horse. But they are almost certainly in service to the state (for the benefit of the Stewards and the military), not accessible to the common person.

That's what I was (very inarticulately) trying to get at... the Shire works the way it does because of the population's attitudes and peaceful nature. Making an archive is not unknown to Gondor; but making it available to everyone sure is...

That was also what I probably failed to get across also and what was ROCMISTRO getting at.

Everyone thanks for you replies.

[Rocmistro]

It's worth mentioning that my comments were really directed at Stormcrow, as he was the first, I believe, to supplant Southron Loremaster's accurate descriptor "modern" with the imprecise term "technology" (an honest mistake I'm sure)

[aramis]

There is another aspect to consider. Apart from the "internal" approaches to the problem (finding ways to explain the different phenomena within Middle-earth as done exemplary in the previous post by Otaku-sempai), you have to consider the "external" as well.
Originally, The Hobbit was not written and designed for Middle-earth (i.e. Tolkien's beloved Silmarillion world). Only later, when his publisher asked for a sequel (which became the LotR), did Tolkien integrate it into this world. This was done only superficially (and as a slight modification of the finished book) for several reasons.
But as a bottom line, Tolkien was not thinking of his Silmarillion world (which was his primary interest for decades) as a backdrop when he wrote The Hobbit and thus made the Shire more into a cozy place of an idealised 19th century rural England which he so loved rather than a small place of the Sil-world in later times.

Everything I've read indicates the opposite about the relation of the Silmarillion - the Silmarillion was his initial offering of a sequel to the Hobbit, rejected for lack of hobbits. And the Hobbit was a record of the children's tale version of his Arda of the Silmarillion; the prototype from which Arda grew.

I'll note that the big difference isn't the overall tech level - it's the way that tech works.

Hobbits and men both use pure technology - to different ends. Hobbits use it for comforts. Men use it for weapons.

Elves use pure magic. So do Istari. Elves for comforts, Istari for tasks.

Dwarves mix the two. From some points of view, so also the Uruk.

[Tolwen]

Everything I've read indicates the opposite about the relation of the Silmarillion - the Silmarillion was his initial offering of a sequel to the Hobbit, rejected for lack of hobbits.

It might be that the publishers did not want the Sil after publication of the Hobbit due to the very different style and tone, but Tolkien's work on the Silmarillion legends (his primary interest) predates the one on the Hobbit by about 20 years.
After the commercial success of the Hobbit, the publishers wanted more about Hobbits and not hard-to-digest ancient and tragic legends. Thus Tolkien eventually began the work on the LotR rather than trying to press the case of his far-developed Silmarillion work.

Cheers
Tolwen