The price of the Marsh-dweller treasure

[Heilemann]

So my players, whose D&D tendencies are hard to shake, have become obsessed with two things:

1) Azgrask the orc, whom they intend to hunt at any cost. But nevermind that, I count that as a mistake on my part. I have a plan for when he'll emerge again, although unfortunately their pursuit of him has blinded them to any number of other clues.

2) The treasure from the Marsh-bell.

They're in the Anduin Vales now, but they keep referring back to it and at some point I'm sure they'll want to go back to claim it from the creatures that dwell in the marsh.

So on the one hand, I could let them have it at the cost of some corruption. But it seems almost too easy? Sure they'll have to mount an expedition etc, but a few Corruption Tests seem too small a price for them to pay. Maybe the treasure is haunted? Maybe there's a special item in it which is treasured by some other party who wants it back? Maybe when they use money from it they get Corruption Tests?

Any other takes?

[Glorelendil]

TPK is a steep cost, too.

[Stormcrow]

The treasure from "The Marsh Bell" is really just a heavy-handed way to tempt players to do the wrong thing. It isn't fully defined. The first thing you have to do is decide how many Treasure Points the hoard is worth (probably somewhere around 10 points, the equivalent of a goblin hoard). Then apply the Tainted Treasure table from Clarifications and Amendments: it's probably a Moderate Corruption Test to avoid 1 Shadow Point. You'll also need to decide exactly how many mewli—I mean, marsh dwellers—there actually are in the place. "Marsh Bell" is intentionally, and irritatingly, vague about that; there are at least eighteen before the adventurers get there.

I don't see any need to punish players for seeking treasure, especially if they have a treasure-hunter among them. Your plot ideas are all good ones. Perhaps someone overhears the player-heroes' description of the marsh dwellers' treasure and recognizes something, and wants it. Since your players already want to get the treasure, they don't need someone to send them on a quest—instead, have someone ready to steal it from them as soon as they retrieve it.

[Glorelendil]

Thinking more about this, you could get your players to understand (maybe by doing some research and rolling some Lore) that if they go back before they've earned a bunch of XP and are more powerful, they are going to die. So let them make it a long-term goal (sort of like Thorin and Erebor...).

That means, of course, that they're going to have to keep it a secret for X years. Lots of chances to blow that.

When they finally return, perhaps something more powerful than a Marsh Dweller has moved in, and the dwellers are his/her/its minions.

And if they failed to keep it a secret, maybe they have competition.

[Hermes Serpent]

I'd remind them that 1 Treasure Point is equivalent to 1 Fatigue Point. For most characters they'll need ponies at least to carry any amount of treasure out or they'll fall prey to the first hobgoblin group that spots them trudging through the marsh. If they try to put treasure in their packs then they'll likely be Weary before they start the trek back out of the marsh. I hear that Marsh hags love shiny objects (and fresh meat).

Have them consider why the treasure is still there, people go missing all the time when travelling through the marsh.

[Dunheved]

You sound like you need closure on this sidelined treasure.

Can I suggest a few ways to remove this lust for gold? You can even roll a Success dice to choose!
1. THE HAND OF DOOM Quote Thorin's dying words to Bilbo about treasuring companionship above gold. State that this is a final warning. Have fatal accidents befall any adventurer who ignores this hint. (Harsh isn't it?)
2. THE HAND OF PSYCHOLOGY Your adventurers are all suffering from Dragon Sickness. Make them miserable with extra points of Shadow. Radagast is the right sort of person to heal them of these Shadow points if they swear to never return or mention that treasure again.
3. THE HAND OF CHANCE Get the news to them that a large group of experienced adventurers have managed to retrieve the treasure already and are spending it in the Drunken Stone in Laketown. One free drink for all.
4. THE HAND OF FATE Let them go to the treasure chamber to find it empty - of both Marsh dwellers and treasure. Gain 1 Experience point and a hatful of humility.
5. THE HAND OF BALANCE Gain the treasure but lose a lot of their personal possessions in the Long Marshes that will need replacing: cost of their losses = value of the treasure gained.
6. THE ITCHY HAND Have them develop an allergy to the marsh dwellers touch: and to anything covered in the slime of the marsh dwellers. They cannot pick up the treasure without getting so itchy that they drop it all again.

Of course you could let them buy shares in the Red Dwarf Mining Company: this is one of my character sets and I guarantee that an investment here will produce very little return....

[Woodclaw]

As Dunheved observed, if they're so obsessed over the treasure, they're most likely suffering from Dragon Sickness, so I would consider to give them Shadow Points automaticly, instead of having them roll any kind of Corruption Test. If they keep thinking as D&D-ish style tomb robbers that's their problem since it would make everything much harder and I highly doubt that they will ever be seen asanything more than troublemakers, even in the most quiet and understanding regions.

[Murcushio]

Honestly, your plot ideas are all good ones. Going treasure-hunting should necessitate things like corruption tests, competitors for said treasure, the possibility of getting swarmed by things that want to eat you, that sort of thing. I wouldn't go too heavy-handed on the corruption tests, though. You showed the players a treasure and then yanked it away from them already; making it overly cursed when they go back for it is just a bit mean, I think.

The thing with the orc actually sounds pretty awesome and opportunity for some primo roleplaying. Orcs are smarter than people think they are, and it sounds like your group is already letting their zeal blind them a bit. That's great! Have Azgrask take advantage of that and jerk them around like fish on a line. Don't be a dick about that (really, the optimal outcome of "your PC's want to go hunt this one specific orc" is "they find and kill him"; letting him escape or having them come up short too many times by fiat is just going to make them frustrated and kill their fun) but like I said... orcs are smarter than people think, and if they keep riding into ambushes or following false trails, eventually they'll wise up.

I'd remind them that 1 Treasure Point is equivalent to 1 Fatigue Point. For most characters they'll need ponies at least to carry any amount of treasure out .

Question. Are there actual rules for that anywhere? Official ones?

My Fellowship got their first major haul of loot in our last session, and being able to carry it all was a real issue, especially since the loot isn't, technically, ours; we have to haul it back to Dale and give it to Bard or the unquiet shades guarding it will be not cool with us. So we're all loaded up right near our maximum encumbrance, which might cause issues if we get attacked before we clear Mirkwood.

Someone mentioned that if we hadn't been in Mirkwood, we could have just brought horses to haul it all away, and our GM was like "You know, there aren't actually rules for that, I don't think. I went digging, and all horses do is make various Fatigue checks easier. There are no specific rules for storing gear and treasure on them."

And unless we're all blind, it would appear he's right. That said... we've all been provably blind when it comes to the rules-as-written before, so...

[Stormcrow]

On the one hand, there's being obsessed with treasure. On the other, the game does encourage treasure-hunting as a legitimate activity, and the marsh-dwellers are known to have a pretty fabulous treasure.

The idea that you're not "supposed" to get a treasure is a bad one. The treasure is there, so a character that finds a way to acquire it should acquire it. It might be tainted, it might not be what the character expects, but the Loremaster or—worse—the adventure-writer shouldn't be telling players what they can and cannot try to do.

"The Marsh Bell" is designed to showcase the various features of the game, and it does this well. However, it's not a very good adventure—it's a railroad, and the marsh-dwellers' treasure is just a cardboard standee erected along the tracks. I think it's perfectly natural for players to want to get that treasure, and I think it's a good idea for the Loremaster to turn that standee into the real thing and to let the player-heroes hop out of their railroad car to try to get it.

[Stormcrow]

I'd remind them that 1 Treasure Point is equivalent to 1 Fatigue Point. For most characters they'll need ponies at least to carry any amount of treasure out .

Question. Are there actual rules for that anywhere? Official ones?

For putting Treasure on horses? No.

You could probably add the number of Treasure Points to your traveling encumbrance. However, I can't imagine how Bilbo managed to get 500 Treasure Points home that way!

Alternatively, you can just assume that mounts can bear the weight of any amount of treasure you're likely to carry. Of course, this then leads to characters always leaving their treasure on their mounts.