Dagger called shot

[cuthalion]

Ok, so I don't want to bring up discussions of dual wielding, and I've searched the forums on this and haven't been able to find anything, so with that in mind, what do you all think?

My feeling is this would make the dagger a little more useful and add a small option for variety into combat. I could see it being useful/dramatic when disarmed (perhaps buying you enough time to retrieve primary weapon safely), or even just to draw and use it one round as an alternative to your primary weapon (presuming you have the hand free). Would also make that famous dagger you just found in a hoard that bit more fun.

(So, just to clarify, I don't see this as dual wielding, but more like one of the combat options--something that lasts a round, or a few rounds. I.e. you're forced to use your dagger, you fight a round with it, declare called shot the next round, retrieve or switch back to your primary weapon, etc.)

My concerns are, that I'm picking up more on the movies here than the books (I've done a quick text search of Hobbit and LOTR, my Tolkien scholarship not being up to much, and it really seems that no character ever really employs this kind of tactic, and, that knives/daggers are much more the territory of (sneaky/underhand) orcs/goblins than anything else (bar the swords of hobbits, of course))---and also that I don't have the RPG experience/handle on TOR to understand the balance issues involved etc.

So, I was planning on doing a bit of research on it myself at some point, but thought I would throw it out for ideas/opinions since lots of you are much more knowledgeable on Tolkien/TOR and I expect lots have their own ideas.

I suppose my rough idea for the effect would be something like:

'The target has been hampered. You do not wound your enemy seriously, but your dagger lodges in an arm, or leg, or you leave a deep gash, reducing all attack/defence TN against this enemy by one level. Additionally, if you have been disarmed, you may retrieve your primary weapon (a non-combat action) safely, as an automatic action.'

[Morgoth]

I've searched the forums on this and haven't been able to find anything

Really? Well either way, here are some threads you might find interesting:

viewtopic.php?f=7&t=2311

viewtopic.php?f=7&t=1876

viewtopic.php?f=7&t=1550

viewtopic.php?f=7&t=125

viewtopic.php?f=7&t=741

[cuthalion]

Really? Well either way, here are some threads you might find interesting:

Hmmm ... well, all of those seem to deal with dual wielding, or simultaneous attacks, whereas I'm more interested in the fact that all weapons have a called shot except the dagger, and was just proposing that it might be kind of cool if one existed.

Then again, maybe I'm alone here? Really ? ...

[Morgoth]

Oops, I should really read more carefully.

[cuthalion]

No worries. I think, re-reading, that first sentence wasn't super clear.

[Morgoth]

Your called shot is interesting though. I honestly haven't seen any PC disarmed, but if they were, it would be a useful option. However the thing about called shots, is that they're more useful the more ranks you have in a weapon. Most people don't gain a second rank in dagger, so called shots are not likely to work.

[cuthalion]

Fair point--but also, that's sort of the point. It seems like there's hardly any incentive to use/improve Dagger. But maybe if it actually came in handy, or offered some good storytelling moments, or a way to add a little uniqueness to your character, then people might spend XP on it.

Personally, I just hate to see it sitting there so unutilized--but then, like I said, it certainly doesn't seem to come up in Tolkien much, so maybe Cubicle 7 had this figured all along . . .

[Morgoth]

Well, the way I got people to use daggers, is I put magic daggers in the campaign. It's worked to some degree at least

[Corvo]

I simply houseruled daggers (and short swords) taking the sword as model:

Sword: dam 5; edge 10; inj. 16; disarm (=RAW: it's here just for comparison)
Short Sword: dam 4; edge 10; inj. 15; disarm
Dagger: dam 3; edge 10; inj. 14; piercing blow

[Morgoth]

One thing I've thought about is putting daggers in the same weapon group as swords. That way people with (swords) would use them for ranged attacks.