Advice for a group of newbies

[Bomilkar]

Welcome to the forums, mate. You've already got some great advice here, so let me second everything that my fellow posters wrote. Something I would like to especially remark on is Elfcrusher's hint on sharing the responsibility of describing things. Doing this not only takes away some pressure from the LM, it also keeps the players more invested in certain aspects of the story and, above all, it leads to much more creative and surprising outcomes for everyone involved.

For example, in most situation involving die rolling, we use dice cups. One of the players tells us what he intends to do, rolls the dice, peaks under the cup, and continues the narration without telling the result. Sometimes, the result becomes immediately obvious through the narration - e. g. in a social encounter a character begins to stumble over his words or use arguments that could easily be considered offensive by the opposing party. Just as often, however, players like to create a certain amount of tension before reaching the eventual outcome. It helps even more, if you give your players a rough idea about the opponents' strengths and weaknesses before the battle, because then they can tie those to their descriptions of failure or success ("I put all my strength behind the strike, but the creature evades it with an unsettling swiftness") The great thing is that these stories will still be remembered after many sessions.

This also goes for the descriptions of locations or characters. When our fellowship entered Woodmen-Town, I left it to our Woodmen character (who had read the description beforehand) to describe all the details of his hometown to his friends. He did this better than I would have been able to and I could spend some time thinking about the next encounter.

What also works really well is asking your players questions about the world and the characters, which is something I learned from Apocalypse World. For example, when my players met Arciryas, a Gondorian healer (described in HOTW), on the shore of the River Anduin, I asked the following three questions, one to each player:

1) How can you see that this man hails from the land of Gondor?
2) Why is it obvious that this man has spent a long time in the wild?
3) What is the object that the man keeps touching absent-mindedly?

The first player began by describing the pride in Arciryas' face and his manners, a pride sometimes bordering on arrogance. The second player went on by adding how this prideful demeanour was contrasted by his harrowed look and his weather-beaten clothes, which had seen too many winters. And the third player told us how Arciryas' fingers kept on fondling a small piece of parchment, on which the observant eye could see the portrait of a woman and a child. Only three questions, and a new character had taken shape in our collective minds.

Of course, some players might prefer not to have that amount of narrative control, but if you have players who don't mind that kind of thing, go for it. It is definitely worth it.

[zedturtle]

What also works really well is asking your players questions about the world and the characters, which is something I learned from Apocalypse World. For example, when my players met Arciryas, a Gondorian healer (described in HOTW), on the shore of the River Anduin, I asked the following three questions, one to each player:

1) How can you see that this man hails from the land of Gondor?
2) Why is it obvious that this man has spent a long time in the wild?
3) What is the object that the man keeps touching absent-mindedly?

The first player began by describing the pride in Arciryas' face and his manners, a pride sometimes bordering on arrogance. The second player went on by adding how this prideful demeanour was contrasted by his harrowed look, and his weather-beaten clothes, which had seen to many winters. And the third player told us how Arciryas' fingers kept on fondling a small piece of parchment, on which the observant eye could see the portrait of a woman and a child. Only three questions, and a new character had taken shape in our collective minds.

Fascinating. That approach (asking questions about imagery) is actually a part of Everway's character creation process... I had no idea that the AW engine used similar methods (I've avoided AW itself for reasons, and DW because I've got too many ways already to scratch that itch.)

[mirkwoodfalcon]

Welcome to the forums, mate. You've already got some great advice here, so let me second everything that my fellow posters wrote. Something I would like to especially remark on is Elfcrusher's hint on sharing the responsibility of describing things. Doing this not only takes away some pressure from the LM, it also keeps the players more invested in certain aspects of the story and, above all, it leads to much more creative and surprising outcomes for everyone involved.

For example, in most situation involving die rolling, we use dice cups. One of the players tells us what he intends to do, rolls the dice, peaks under the cup, and continues the narration without telling the result. Sometimes, the result becomes immediately obvious through the narration - e. g. in a social encounter a character begins to stumble over his words or use arguments that could easily be considered offensive by the opposing party. Just as often, however, players like to create a certain amount of tension before reaching the eventual outcome. It helps even more, if you give your players a rough idea about the opponents' strengths and weaknesses before the battle, because then they can tie those to their descriptions of failure or success ("I put all my strength behind the strike, but the creature evades it with an unsettling swiftness") The great thing is that these stories will still be remembered after many sessions.

This also goes for the descriptions of locations or characters. When our fellowship entered Woodmen-Town, I left it to our Woodmen character (who had read the description beforehand) to describe all the details of his hometown to his friends. He did this better than I would have been able to and I could spend some time thinking about the next encounter.

What also works really well is asking your players questions about the world and the characters, which is something I learned from Apocalypse World. For example, when my players met Arciryas, a Gondorian healer (described in HOTW), on the shore of the River Anduin, I asked the following three questions, one to each player:

1) How can you see that this man hails from the land of Gondor?
2) Why is it obvious that this man has spent a long time in the wild?
3) What is the object that the man keeps touching absent-mindedly?

The first player began by describing the pride in Arciryas' face and his manners, a pride sometimes bordering on arrogance. The second player went on by adding how this prideful demeanour was contrasted by his harrowed look, and his weather-beaten clothes, which had seen to many winters. And the third player told us how Arciryas' fingers kept on fondling a small piece of parchment, on which the observant eye could see the portrait of a woman and a child. Only three questions, and a new character had taken shape in our collective minds.

Of course, some players might prefer not to have that amount of narrative control, but if you have players who don't mind that kind of thing, go for it. It is definitely worth it.

Really appreciate the advice, everyone!

Bomilkar in particular, the idea of having the players do a lot of the narration is interesting to me; we've been having the lore master to nearly all narration related to dice rolls, leaving the players to simply narrate their intent before the roll or other events like conversation. I really like the part about asking the players some questions and developing the world/characters based on their answers. We'll have to try that.

[HotSnow50]

Oh, yeah! Forgot to say!
Absolutley use Voidstate's Battle and Travel Mats.

I can't find the links in this forum, but you can find both here:
http://boardgamegeek.com/filepage/72263 ... stance-mat

and here:
http://boardgamegeek.com/filepage/72264 ... travel-mat


Edit: Well, the sticky thread TOR Resources has it, of course.

Travel mat by voidstate:
http://www.voidstate.com/rpg/voidstate_ ... mat_v1.pdf

Battle board by voidstate:
http://www.voidstate.com/rpg/voidstate_ ... t_v1-1.pdf

I downloaded both of those Mats (the travel and the battle) and am looking at them now. The Battle one is brilliant, and I can't wait to employ it, but the TRAVEL one has me wondering something, and I thought I read the travel section of the revised rulebook (2014) through and understood it all but, apparently I don't. Here's the few questions that I have:

1) First Question... When I look at the sheet I notice a field showing "*gandalf rune* Players Choice, *eye of sauron* unfilled role, *10* all companions"

2) Second Question... Why 6 hexes labelled Hazards?

3) Third Question... 1-3 Guide, 4-5 Huntsmen, 6-7 Scouts, 8-9 Look-Out Men... I must not understand how the travel phase is handled, because this is not intuitive to me... Help!

4) Fourth Question... Is the area on the right border of the page (labeled Fatigue Tests: 1-7) just a place for you to recall how many fatigue tests you've determined will be needed for this Journey?

Thank you for all the help, in advance!

[Falenthal]

1) First Question... When I look at the sheet I notice a field showing "*gandalf rune* Players Choice, *eye of sauron* unfilled role, *10* all companions"

3) Third Question... 1-3 Guide, 4-5 Huntsmen, 6-7 Scouts, 8-9 Look-Out Men... I must not understand how the travel phase is handled, because this is not intuitive to me... Help!

When a Hazard is triggered (an Eye is rolled in a Fatigue test), the Loremaster has to see which role is affected by the Hazard. To do so, he rolls a 12-sided dice and looks at this numbers: The Hazard may apply to one of the roles if the roll was between 1 and 9, to all Companions (Corruption tests, new Fatigue rolls,...) on a 10, to someone the players choose on a Gandalf (normally the player with the highest skill related to his role) or to the worst possible role (either because nobody covers it or to the one that, being covered, has the player with the lowest skill related to it).

2) Second Question... Why 6 hexes labelled Hazards?

I guess there wasn't place for more. Everytime someone rolls an Eye, the LM can put a counter on a hex. This keeps track of how many Hazards need to be played on the company. Keep in mind that sometimes a journey's leg can ask for 2 or 3 Fatigue rolls from every player. The LM can choose to make all those rolls and decide about the Hazards later. This helps him keep track of the Eyes rolled as they appear on the dices, until all rolls have been made.

4) Fourth Question... Is the area on the right border of the page (labeled Fatigue Tests: 1-7) just a place for you to recall how many fatigue tests you've determined will be needed for this Journey?

Yes. Or, at least, for a Journey's leg. See answer to Question 2. As the multiple rolls for the multiple tests are being made, you can put a counter on how many Fatigue tests are still left.

Hope it helps and hope I use the rules right, so that my answers didn't introduce new confusion!

[HotSnow50]

Thanks man! I don't have anyone in my area to ask about this stuff, so I have to ask my questions here. Thank you for the time! It did make sense

So when you decide how many fatigue tests will be done, each player rolls those tests based upon the skill they have in the role theu have chosen in the party... right? So, of anyone fails they get fatigue based upon their travel gear weight for that season... if someone rolls an "eye," even if they succeed on their fatigue test, the Loremaster knows that that is a hazard that needs to be tossed at the party. The Loremaster then rolls a feat die, 1-9 means that hazard is directed at THAT corresponding player, 10 means the hazard is directed at the whole party, gandalf rune the party picks who gets it in the shorts (is the target of the hazard) and an eye rune the hazard befalls the weakest member? Have I got that right?

[Glorelendil]

Thanks man! I don't have anyone in my area to ask about this stuff, so I have to ask my questions here. Thank you for the time! It did make sense

So when you decide how many fatigue tests will be done, each player rolls those tests based upon the skill they have in the role theu have chosen in the party... right? So, of anyone fails they get fatigue based upon their travel gear weight for that season... if someone rolls an "eye," even if they succeed on their fatigue test, the Loremaster knows that that is a hazard that needs to be tossed at the party. The Loremaster then rolls a feat die, 1-9 means that hazard is directed at THAT corresponding player, 10 means the hazard is directed at the whole party, gandalf rune the party picks who gets it in the shorts (is the target of the hazard) and an eye rune the hazard befalls the weakest member? Have I got that right?

Not quite. The LM's roll determines who the Hazard is targeted at. It used to be targeted at whoever triggered it, but that meant whoever had the lowest Travel got all the Hazards. So if the LM rolls a 4, for example, whoever is assigned Scout gets the Hazards. And on eye it's not the weakest member, it's a role that isn't covered. So if you've got a scout, a guide, and a look-out, an eye means a hunting hazard and somebody will have to make a hunting roll.

[Falenthal]

Ask as much as you want, pal! That's why the forums where created in the first place.

So when you decide how many fatigue tests will be done, each player rolls those tests based upon the skill they have in the role theu have chosen in the party... right?

No, the Fatigue tests are ALWAYS rolled with the Travel skill.
The skill related to the assigned role (Awareness for Look-out, etc.) comes only into play if a Hazard targets your role, to avoid said Hazard.

And on eye it's not the weakest member, it's a role that isn't covered. So if you've got a scout, a guide, and a look-out, an eye means a hunting hazard and somebody will have to make a hunting roll.

What Elfcrusher says is right, only that I think two points should be clarified:
1) An Eye targets whatever is worse for the group. That means that if any role isn't covered, that will be the first option. But in case every role is covered, the LM will surely choose whoever has the lowest skill in his corresponding role. Or if there's a Weary hero, he might also be the chosen target even if his skill ranks are better than anyone else's.
2) If a role is not covered and is affected by a Hazard, the companions have two options: suffer the efects of the Hazard or anyone can spend a Hope point to temporarily cover that role and face the Hazard.

[Falenthal]

Did I mention using Elfcrusher's Journeyometer?

No, I didn't.

Use it.

viewtopic.php?f=7&t=1770

[HotSnow50]

So if the LM rolls a 4, for example, whoever is assigned Scout gets the Hazards.

When I look at the mat that I downloaded, "4" is within the huntsmen zone (4-5) and "scout" gets the hazard if it's 6-7... I don't know of this discrepancy is due to us having different tables... Do I have an outdated mat?