magic

[Mim]

All games evolve (of course), and the magic of D&D of today is certainly different from the original game (I've been gaming for nearly 40 years). For example, Mr. Pulsipher wrote the adventure Khazad-dûm for White Dwarf No. 38, where he listed Gandalf as an 8th level cleric (!) with some additional tweaks.

At any rate, I believe ToR handles magic just about right, though I allow some limited spells for Dúnedain heroes, based (loosely) on the Elven magic in the game - create light, that sort of thing. BTW, the expanded magical artefacts rules in Rivendell answer some of the questions in this thread about weapons.

[Mim]

The essay wasn't actually claiming Gandalf was a minor character with small powers. If I remember correctly (I haven't read it since it was originally published) the point was that most things Gandalf did were not really displays of mighty magic, and that even low level magic-users can appear powerful. It was in response to complaints about d4 hit dice and Vancian Magic.

Or am I remembering it wrong?

You're correct, and that's pretty much why he wrote it.

[Angelalex242]

It's more accurate to say 'Gandalf was a shapeshifted Celestial, (and rose a rank as Gandalf the White. If he was a Planetar as the Grey, he's a Solar now.) As was Radagast (probably a guardinal in his case), as is Saruman (fallen, naturally.) Hell, all the Istari even operate under the same veil the Eladrin are famous for operating under. By contrast, the Balrog was a Balor, and Sauron himself was an Abyssal Lord (Grazz't, Orcus, etc.) Which are still chumps compared to Morgoth, the Divine Rank 19 God of Evil.

[Stormcrow]

Except the article was published in March of 1977; these things didn't exist in D&D yet.

[Glorelendil]

Except the article was published in March of 1977; these things didn't exist in D&D yet.

He wrote an article about Gandalf being a 5th level magic user before there was a such thing as 5th level magic users?

That's just...spooky. (Cue Twilight Zone music.)

Or were you being nitpicky about my use of the terms "Hit Die" and "Vancian magic" although those terms weren't in use at that time? I supposed I could have typed out "getting only one to four hit points per level and having a limited number of spell slots to which you assigned specific spells and could only be used once per day."

But I'm sure everybody else reading this forum knew exactly what I meant.

[Stormcrow]

But I'm sure everybody else reading this forum knew exactly what I meant.

I was responding to AngelAlex242, not you. Cool off, maybe?

[Andrew]

Calm it down please people.