Trolls and Sunlight.

[Otaku-sempai]

Trolls also seemed to get smarter as Sauron gained power:

It seemed that the evil power in Mirkwood had been driven out by the White Council only to reappear in greater strength in the old strongholds in Mordor. The Dark Tower had been rebuilt, it was said. From there the power was spreading far and wide, and away far east and south there were wars and growing fear. Orcs were multiplying again in the mountains. Trolls were abroad, no longer dull-witted, but cunning and armed with dreadful weapons. - The Lord of the Rings, Book 1, Chapter 2 "The Shadow of the Past"

So, perhaps the trolls were also getting more resistant to sunlight and could at least be abroad on heavily overcast days. Direct sunlight would still be a danger to them (with the exception of the Olog-hai).

[zedturtle]

Trolls also seemed to get smarter as Sauron gained power:

It seemed that the evil power in Mirkwood had been driven out by the White Council only to reappear in greater strength in the old strongholds in Mordor. The Dark Tower had been rebuilt, it was said. From there the power was spreading far and wide, and away far east and south there were wars and growing fear. Orcs were multiplying again in the mountains. Trolls were abroad, no longer dull-witted, but cunning and armed with dreadful weapons. - The Lord of the Rings, Book 1, Chapter 2 "The Shadow of the Past"

So, perhaps the trolls were also getting more resistant to sunlight and could at least be abroad on heavily overcast days. Direct sunlight would still be a danger to them (with the exception of the Olog-hai).

Interesting. So that gives an early date of 2951 for trolls to become more active during the day but Aragorn could still feel confident that there would be no Trolls out in the open on a clear sunny day (especially since they were being stone-silent).

[Stormcrow]

I've posted previously a theory that I've heard and quite like: because Morgoth (and later, Sauron, if he possessed the art) could not create true life of his own, he created "deceits" in mockery of ents. They're made from stone and animated to appear to be alive, and the magic operates independent of Morgoth. The illusion is so effective that it borders on truth. But it's still just an illusion, and when the light of the sun exposes the illusion, the spell is broken and the troll reverts back to plain stone.

Olag-hai might be immune to the sun because they are "filled with the evil will of their master." That is, unlike normal trolls, who operate by means of a spell that makes them appear alive, Olag-hai are actually being consciously animated by Morgoth or Sauron. We know they have the power to split and set their wills in their many servants, including the Olag-hai. The "deceit" is being actively maintained, and so even the light of the sun won't reveal it as false. Olag-hai are still not strictly alive, but as long as their master moves them about you can't tell the difference.

I imagine when Sauron was overthrown with the destruction of the Ring, the Olag-hai in his service either turned to stone immediately or were downgraded to ordinary trolls. Only those lucky enough to be out of the sun when this happened would have survived. Ordinary trolls, meanwhile, remain animated by the "Morgoth-element" spread over Middle-earth by him.

[zedturtle]

I like that idea, especially as it can somewhat explain Ettins (they are either failures of the spell to take complete hold, or trolls that turned to stone but enough magic remained for whatever reason for them to still be capable of occasional activity).

I think Otaku's quote above can help the gamists (on whose side I come down, for the most part) explain why Trolls might be even more active after 2951; Sauron is actively spreading his power and perhaps Orodruin (in 2954) is a 'supply beacon' to cause all manner of evil creatures to stir and remember their old master.

[Stormcrow]

Indeed, that is exactly why I think trolls start getting smarter and more dangerous. They're getting orders from Sauron, and he's putting his will into them.

[Majestic]

I like that idea, especially as it can somewhat explain Ettins (they are either failures of the spell to take complete hold, or trolls that turned to stone but enough magic remained for whatever reason for them to still be capable of occasional activity).

I think Otaku's quote above can help the gamists (on whose side I come down, for the most part) explain why Trolls might be even more active after 2951; Sauron is actively spreading his power and perhaps Orodruin (in 2954) is a 'supply beacon' to cause all manner of evil creatures to stir and remember their old master.

I'm curious why that would be a gamist viewpoint, zed? I admit I'm not any kind of expert on the gamist/narrativist/simulationist dynamics, but I would have thought the reasons given (for Trolls to be more active after 2951) would be more of a simulationist rationale.

[zedturtle]

I like that idea, especially as it can somewhat explain Ettins (they are either failures of the spell to take complete hold, or trolls that turned to stone but enough magic remained for whatever reason for them to still be capable of occasional activity).

I think Otaku's quote above can help the gamists (on whose side I come down, for the most part) explain why Trolls might be even more active after 2951; Sauron is actively spreading his power and perhaps Orodruin (in 2954) is a 'supply beacon' to cause all manner of evil creatures to stir and remember their old master.

I'm curious why that would be a gamist viewpoint, zed? I admit I'm not any kind of expert on the gamist/narrativist/simulationist dynamics, but I would have thought the reasons given (for Trolls to be more active after 2951) would be more of a simulationist rationale.

Oh no. I didn't mean to bring up the spectre of GNS! (almost bad as Midi-chlorians). I was just referencing Stormcrow's post in the other thread. (So gamist vs literalist). And, yes, I suppose you're right.

[poosticks7]

Steps into thread and throws a 'half trolls of Harad' hand grenade then runs away (giggling).

[DavetheLost]

Can you cite the chapter for the Half-trolls?

Best way to make a half-troll is to whack a whole troll really hard with a sharp Great Axe.

[zedturtle]

Can you cite the chapter for the Half-trolls?

Best way to make a half-troll is to whack a whole troll really hard with a sharp Great Axe.

The Battle of Pelennor Fields.