Eye Awareness & The Question of the Dunedain

[Falenthal]

It's an interesting question as to what proportion of men of Gondor count as Dunedain, although I'd suggest Boromir does.

I'd say, at least for game purpouses, that only the highest lines do: the Stewards (Denethor, Boromir, Faramir) and the line of Dol Amroth (Imrahil).

In fact, Denethor's wife (and Boromir and Faramir's mother, of course) was the sister of Imrahil, Finduilas. So, little do we know about others families that could claim some purity of dúnedain blood.

But I guess the 'typical' Man of Gondor will be Beregrond, not Boromir or Faramir. Would you consider Beregrond a Dúnedain, equal to the Rangers of the North?

We should take a look at what the Return of the King says about the time when Halbarad & Co. arrive to Minas Tirith, to see if the Rangers are depicted as taller, stronger, better than the gondorian soldiers.

I remember a passage when a messenger from Gondor brings the Red Arrow to Theoden, and he is described (by Merry, IIRC) as being the pure image of Boromir. But then again, Boromir is not "as dúnedain" as Faramir is, or even Denethor.

[Murazor]

I'd say Boromir is every inch as much of a Dunadan as his father, brother and relatives from Dol Amroth. Certainly not as wise or courtly, he's described as being more of a warrior in the mould of king Earnur but not all numenoreans were wise.

Now I wouldn't suggest the average farmer from Lamedon counts as a Dunadan but I wonder what proportion of the population does. Clearly there would be a lot of mixing with the locals over thousands of years, but not all of those who sailed with Elendil were nobles. I would imagine the faithful included farmers, foot soldiers, sailors etc were they any less Dunedain than their leaders ?

[Falenthal]

Having the books now with me, I have to withdraw my assumption that only the royal lines should be considered Dúnedain.

At least, we have this about the Rangers of Ithilien:

They spoke together in soft voices, at first using the Common Speech, but after the manner of older days, and then changing to another language of their own. To his amazement, as he listened Frodo became aware that it was the elven-tongue that they spoke, or one but little different; and he looked at them with wonder, for he knew then that they must be Dúnedain of the South, men of the line of the Lords of Westernesse.

After a while he spoke to them; but they were slow and cautious in answering. They named themselves Mablung and Damrod, soldiers of Gondor, and they were Rangers of Ithilien; for they were descended from folk who lived in Ithilien at one time, before it was overrun. From such men the Lord Denethor chose his forayers,

So Mablung and Damrod, two 'plain soldiers of Gondor', are considered Dúnedain of the South.

Others are also described with words normally used for the descendents of Númenor:

A tall man entered, and Merry choked back a cry; for a moment it seemed to him that Boromir was alive again and had returned. Then he saw that it was not so; the man was a stranger, though as like to Boromir as if he were one of his kin, tall and grey-eyed and proud.

Pippin looked at him [Beregond]: tall and proud and noble, as all the men that he had yet seen in that land; and with a glitter in his eye as he thought of the battle

So I guess there are still Dúnedain to be found in Gondor, and perfectly usable as PCs.

[Deadmanwalking]

If you wanna go with the Men of Gondor in general counting as Dunedain, I won't argue. Sauron did seem particularly concerned with taking them out. We'll see which way it winds up being in the game when we get the Culture.

My disagreement is with the idea that Boromir would count even if his people didn't.

[Glorelendil]

A related question would be: if Eriador hadn't been wiped out by disease and war, and still had a population to rival the south, would all its people be Dunedain?

[Murazor]

Now there's a question! I think it would depend on when we hypothetically diverge from canon. If Arnor didn't split into it's successor kingdoms I'd speculate quite a high proportion would be Dunedain.
if the split happens but we avoid population collapse then I'd say Arthedain would have the highest proportion and Rhudaur by far the lowest with Cardolan being somewhere in between.

[Lugija]

I think that in Boromir's case him being Dunadan or not mattered less than him being the son of the ruler of Gondor. If the Eye Awareness takes that into account, of course. If it does Legolas as another heir and Aragorn as the possible king would have raised it as well. No wonder the Fellowship between Eregion and Amon Hen could barely move between revelation episodes (or hazards, eight or nine rolling travel rolls for months makes a lot of Eyes).

[poosticks7]

I would rename this thread if I could figure out how

I will try now.

[Otaku-sempai]

Dunedain bloodlines: During the same period of the fifteen Chieftains of the Dunedain of the North, there were twenty-five Ruling Stewards of Gondor. So, while the Gondorian Dunedain were stll living longer than more ordinary Men, their bloodlines were less pure than their northern kin.

[poosticks7]

I think the best real world example I can think of is the Norman and Saxon intermingling to become the English (although there are many other factors and bloodlines that make up us English).

The Norman nobility would have married within themselves or from Europe (which obvious isn't possible for the Dunedain as their home sunk). Eventually they'd intermarry with Saxon lines but for the most part the Norman nobles blood stays pure.

The Norman soldiers wouldn't be so fussy and would quickly take Saxon wives and their blood would soon be considered English.

Now it can't be a direct Parallel because the Norman conquest was an armed invasion. The time period of Gondor is a lot longer and there are many other factors. And as I type this I realise that it isn't that good an example but I think I'm sorta close to the point... maybe.