Real world equivalent time period to Middle Earth?

[Skyspire]

I was wondering what real world time priod would be the equivalent to Middle Earth (more or less). My guess would be around 1000 AD or so, judging by the level of technology. Is my guess more or less right or am I way off?

[Otaku-sempai]

Hmmm. Gondor at the end of the might equate to either the last years of the Roman Empire or the early Renaissance. Numenor at its height might be at about the same level as the late Renaissance. I'm just brainstorming here.

[poosticks7]

Renaissance?

How do you figure that?

[Otaku-sempai]

Renaissance?

How do you figure that?

The Renaissance was a time of exploration and innovation, much like Numenor at its peak. At one point Tolkien had the Numenoreans developing flying ships, but I think that he abandoned the notion fairly quickly (unless you count Earendil and his ship Vingilot).

I probably should have re-thought what I posted about Gondor (and Arnor, I guess); although I think that the comparison stands to Rome in its decline.

[zedturtle]

It's all relative... Wilderland is Britain ca 700 CE, The Shire is Britain ca 1700. Looking at inspiration is one thing, but finding a single time period that had everything ME has is probably an exercise in futility.

[Tolwen]

It's all relative... Wilderland is Britain ca 700 CE, The Shire is Britain ca 1700. Looking at inspiration is one thing, but finding a single time period that had everything ME has is probably an exercise in futility.

Absolutely right. The question to which model(s) of the real world you can look depends completely on the region and timeframe of Middle-earth.
Especially time is a crucial factor, as even such stable political entities like the Númenórean realms change from the undisputed superpower in the Northwest whose might reaches hundreds of miles (Gondor ca. TA 1200 to 1400) to a much diminished and increasingly impotent rump state that is barely able to repel its enemies' attacks on its core territory (and not only at the time of the WotR). In its first incarnation, you could compare Gondor to Rome at the height of its power, while at the latter time, it is more like later Byzantium: Pushed on the strategic defensive and fighting a long retreat, losing more and more territory and calling it a success if it avoids destruction.

The same goes for Wilderland or Eriador: Depending on the timeframe of your choice, fitting models could - and will - look very different for the same region.

Cheers
Tolwen

[Skyspire]

I too figured that Gondor would be the equivalent of Byzantium, but that Numenor would be the equivalent of the Roman empire. The only anomaly that sticks out would be the Shire, which is like 16th or 17th century Britain.

[Tolwen]

I too figured that Gondor would be the equivalent of Byzantium, but that Numenor would be the equivalent of the Roman empire.

Good point. For a model in the political evolution, that's good. A possible model for Gondor might then be Byzantium in general, with its initial expansion and hegemonial power status (like the partly successful attempt of Justinian to restire the old empire), but despite all power still less magnificent than its predecessor (Númenor or imperial Rome).

The only anomaly that sticks out would be the Shire, which is like 16th or 17th century Britain.

And Gondor as well. Tolkien describes part of the Númenórean's cultural habits (the preference for monumental architecture) as "egyptian". That also shows quite good that there isn't a single fitting model for all and everything at once. For Gondor different models apply, depending on whether you look at politics or culture or something else. Add to that the temporal factor, and you see that's no problem to look for different models for different aspects of Middle-earth.

Cheers
Tolwen

[Glorelendil]

I'm now hearing in my head a meeting of the Dunland People's Front (or is the People's Front of Dunland? I forget...)

"And what did the Numenoreans ever do for us?"

...

But...yeah...I think trying to pick one period and one culture isn't going to work. Tolkien lifted bits and pieces from here and there (both historical and fictional) and anybody trying to make sense of it will have to do the same thing.

[farinal]

Third Age definitely has a "Dark Ages" feel to it. I think in a way it is kind of a post apocalyptic time. Just as the Europe went backwards and lost a lot of knowledge and "civilization" after the end of the Second Age and with the end of the Kings in Arnor and Gondor I think it is an accurate example.

It is one of the major theme in Tolkien's works also that the "beauty of the past" is lost now.