Orcs and the "gamefication" of Middle-earth

Adventure in the world of J.R.R. Tolkien’s The Lord of the Rings. Learn more at our website: http://www.cubicle7.co.uk/our-games/the-one-ring/
poosticks7
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Re: Orcs and the "gamefication" of Middle-earth

Post by poosticks7 » Sat Feb 06, 2016 8:37 pm

Boromir was an exceptional warrior and had a heroic death worthy of song. Legolas and Gimli were defending in a siege which are bloody affairs with a high death toll for the attacker. Eomer had cavalry advantage against a lightly equipped orc group on foot (which had been running for days).

I do think orcs at times are treated as cannon fodder in depictions of middle-earth. They are warriors, fierce nasty, brutal warriors.

On another point about middle-earth through a gaming lense.... Elves as uber warriors... because they have hundreds of years to practice... pfft they are too busy singing and enjoying themselves and living to spend huge portions of their lives keeping fighting trim. A lot of martial practice is repetition, for muscle memory. They may have thought in a war a few hundred years ago or more, but seriously you expect them to remember that? Same goes for any other thing they have learnt, seriously how much have you forgotten in the last 10 years, let alone trying to recall something you did a few centuries ago.


Of course this is only my opinion and thankfully the folk who write the One Ring seem to agree with me.

Otaku-sempai
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Re: Orcs and the "gamefication" of Middle-earth

Post by Otaku-sempai » Sat Feb 06, 2016 10:27 pm

poosticks7 wrote:On another point about middle-earth through a gaming lense.... Elves as uber warriors... because they have hundreds of years to practice... pfft they are too busy singing and enjoying themselves and living to spend huge portions of their lives keeping fighting trim. A lot of martial practice is repetition, for muscle memory. They may have thought in a war a few hundred years ago or more, but seriously you expect them to remember that? Same goes for any other thing they have learnt, seriously how much have you forgotten in the last 10 years, let alone trying to recall something you did a few centuries ago.


Of course this is only my opinion and thankfully the folk who write the One Ring seem to agree with me.
The Elves do have the advantage of a form of rest that allows them to (literally?) live in their memories. This allows them to remember events from thousands of years ago as clearly as if they happened last week.
"Far, far below the deepest delvings of the Dwarves, the world is gnawed by nameless things. Even Sauron knows them not. They are older than he."

poosticks7
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Re: Orcs and the "gamefication" of Middle-earth

Post by poosticks7 » Sat Feb 06, 2016 11:43 pm

Yeah that's true I suppose, I guess that would help with memory problems lol.

Not sure about muscle memory though. I guess a lot of elves did die in the first and second age..m they weren't uber.

Arthadan
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Re: Orcs and the "gamefication" of Middle-earth

Post by Arthadan » Mon Feb 08, 2016 7:35 am

poosticks7 wrote:Yeah that's true I suppose, I guess that would help with memory problems lol.

Not sure about muscle memory though. I guess a lot of elves did die in the first and second age..m they weren't uber.
Many died facing dragons and balrogs. Anyway even the mightiest warrior can be slain with a single arrow and the "gamefication" of Elves comes in great part thanks to the movies.

In one of the letters Tolkien wrote was exceptional among Elves, he was sent to Rivendell because he was one of their best warriors, not only because he was a Prince. So Legolas deeds (in the books, not the movie nonsenses) should not be considered something your average Wood Elf can do.

Cawdorthane
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Re: Orcs and the "gamefication" of Middle-earth

Post by Cawdorthane » Wed Feb 10, 2016 12:39 pm

One of the many things I for one like about TOR is the great diversity, personality and flavour it gives to the different types of Orcs/Goblins/Uruks. We are now up to about 10 or 11 published sub-types of Orcs and at least 7 different Orcish "personalities" in the TOR lexicon. And whilst many of these may not pose a huge 1 on 1 threat to a seasoned adventurer, an Eye of Sauron attack roll by the humblest Orc can still rain on the mightiest hero's parade.... The potential for any attack roll to wound a PC is always focussing I find, and TOR certainly has that. Warning your PC's on occasion that the blade of the Orc who is about to swing at them appears to be steeped in something foul or is bespotted with ancient rust and grime of unsavoury origin etc etc also heightens the tension and drama, even if you are simply blowing smoke.

Over the years, my RPG group has often used the Austin Powers joke about musings concerning the motivation of the hapless minion going off to work in Dr Evil's laboratory to provide for his family. Many variations of this theme have been applied to our hapless GM's opponents, but when I GM I sometimes try to weave something like it in, as JRRT did on several occasions, as a device to give individual Orcs or splinter groups within an Orcish company their own motives or flaws, which are often at odds with their Captain's aims or the greater 'good' of the Orcish company to which they belong. No, I agree that Orcs are not stupid per se, but they are morally debased as JRRT makes plain, and this moral deficit can make them vulnerable due to their own wickedness, folly or division. A clever group of PC's in TOR should on occasion be able to exploit this.

Whilst I fear that the real truth is that Orcs in Tolkien's works were indeed the cannon fodder of most battles described by JRRT, that is not to say that they were no threat at all (even Isildur was shot dead by Orcish archers and comments have already been made about the fate of Borrimir), or that Orcish captains or champions were of no account. We should not get too hung up on this cannon fodder concept - we are not playing double digit level heroes in D&D after all, as in TOR enough Orcs of any description, or the presence of one Great Orc, can be decisive if not deadly. It is how the GM gives the Orcish (or any other type of) foes a more 3D feel that avoids gameification and how clever players seek to use what they know or can discern of the Orcs, that can make any combat truly memorable and worthy of a story.

cheers
Mark

Glorelendil
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Re: Orcs and the "gamefication" of Middle-earth

Post by Glorelendil » Wed Feb 10, 2016 2:11 pm

You know what this game needs?









(wait for it....)







Kobolds.
The Munchkin Formerly Known as Elfcrusher
Journey Computer | Combat Simulator | Bestiary | Weapon Calculator

Otaku-sempai
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Re: Orcs and the "gamefication" of Middle-earth

Post by Otaku-sempai » Wed Feb 10, 2016 4:47 pm

I can just imagine Gandalf explaining to Bilbo that the Grey Mountains were full of "goblins, kobolds, and orcs of the worst description."
"Far, far below the deepest delvings of the Dwarves, the world is gnawed by nameless things. Even Sauron knows them not. They are older than he."

Arthadan
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Joined: Sat Jul 20, 2013 2:37 pm

Re: Orcs and the "gamefication" of Middle-earth

Post by Arthadan » Fri Feb 12, 2016 7:15 am

Whay we really need is beholders, Powerful mosters to throw at your PCs (and they should get along nicely with the Eye...)

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