A Couple More Questions Regarding Treasure and Such

[Arinbor]

Hey all,
Been running The One Ring for about 2 months now. My group has a couple of issues with the game that I would like to try and sort out. The first and foremost is the fact that there is not much to do with Treasure besides increase standing. I tried the rule in one of the player made supplements to allow them to buy weapon qualities with it, but it just seemed too powerful considering it is meant to be bought when attaining new ranks in valour.
Does anyone have any suggestions or ideas regarding this?
Second issue is I had a player quit due to him feeling like Dwarves of Erebor were underpowered compared to other races in terms of Valour and Wisdom rewards (even though I tried convincing him that Stiff Neck of the Dwarves is amazing).
Finally, I have been running my group through the Tales of Wilderland as a campaign. I only just acquired The Darkening Of Mirkwood and I am not sure if the party will be too powerful to be challenged by the campaign once Tales is finished. Should I just send the into the Ruins of the North book instead?
Cheers for any input guys,
Arinbor

[Deadmanwalking]

Hey all,
Been running The One Ring for about 2 months now. My group has a couple of issues with the game that I would like to try and sort out. The first and foremost is the fact that there is not much to do with Treasure besides increase standing. I tried the rule in one of the player made supplements to allow them to buy weapon qualities with it, but it just seemed too powerful considering it is meant to be bought when attaining new ranks in valour.
Does anyone have any suggestions or ideas regarding this?

You're quite right, that is too much. One thing that the game already does that you could expand on is allow the expenditure of Treasure to buy a tool to aid in a particular common skill, giving a +1 (not +1 die) bonus on rolls with that skill. You can then upgrade it to a +2 by getting a better tool. Now, by the official rules (found in the Laketown book, which I recommend), this is an option only in Lake Town, and costs a Fellowship Phase spent shopping as well as Treasure.

That said, allowing it in other places or without the Phase spent shopping (possibly at higher prices) doesn't seem like it'd break anything.

Another possibility that's cool but not mechanically unbalancing is permanently increasing lifestyle by a category (like from Martial to Prosperous) for a fair amount of Treasure. That's very much a House rule, though.

Second issue is I had a player quit due to him feeling like Dwarves of Erebor were underpowered compared to other races in terms of Valour and Wisdom rewards (even though I tried convincing him that Stiff Neck of the Dwarves is amazing).

Wow. Dwarves are amazing, so I have no real idea what that guy's problem was. What was his build like as compared to other peoples?

Finally, I have been running my group through the Tales of Wilderland as a campaign. I only just acquired The Darkening Of Mirkwood and I am not sure if the party will be too powerful to be challenged by the campaign once Tales is finished. Should I just send the into the Ruins of the North book instead?
Cheers for any input guys,
Arinbor

Well, what our GM has been doing is interweaving the two (Tales and DoM), with each year involving at least one adventure/set of events from each. Seems to have worked out okay, though I'm not sure how much he's modifying things...

[Arinbor]

You're quite right, that is too much. One thing that the game already does that you could expand on is allow the expenditure of Treasure to buy a tool to aid in a particular common skill, giving a +1 (not +1 die) bonus on rolls with that skill. You can then upgrade it to a +2 by getting a better tool. Now, by the official rules (found in the Laketown book, which I recommend), this is an option only in Lake Town, and costs a Fellowship Phase spent shopping as well as Treasure.
That said, allowing it in other places or without the Phase spent shopping (possibly at higher prices) doesn't seem like it'd break anything.
Another possibility that's cool but not mechanically unbalancing is permanently increasing lifestyle by a category (like from Martial to Prosperous) for a fair amount of Treasure. That's very much a House rule, though.

I hadnt seen the tools rule, are you able to direct me to where that is? It sounds really good.

Wow. Dwarves are amazing, so I have no real idea what that guy's problem was. What was his build like as compared to other peoples?

I am not sure, but he WAS trying to do a lot of stuff he wasnt skilled in and failing rolls. Hes a regular gamer with us so it was suprising to see him react and play like this. He probably just needs time. EDIT: Just spoke to my other dwarf player and he feels every other races rewards and virtues are better. He feels all the dwarfs have going for them is the Stiff Neck of the Dwarves ability allowing them to add their shadow score to common skill rolls.

Well, what our GM has been doing is interweaving the two (Tales and DoM), with each year involving at least one adventure/set of events from each. Seems to have worked out okay, though I'm not sure how much he's modifying things...

That is what I wanted to do, but we are already on the third adventure so I am not sure if I can start incorporating the events from darkening of mirkwood.

Thanks heaps for the input mate,
Arinbor

[Indur Dawndeath]

SPOILERS**
We completed the Tales with only 2949 in Darkening. I can tell you the company is plenty challenged in Dol Guldur and against the Werewolf. I am tweeking stats and number of opponents, but the setting is grim and frightful enough.
Eye of Mordor rules also make life hard on the players. They got a revelation just at they were supposed to be ambushed, so I gave them no chance to discover the attack. They got their ass kicked and lost everything to Valdis' outlaw crew. In Helm of Peace... Now they need to steal it back with no weapons or armour.

As for the initial question, then they also spend Treasure on horses now... And I've allowed them to improve their Holdings by spending treasure

Cheers

[Deadmanwalking]

I hadnt seen the tools rule, are you able to direct me to where that is? It sounds really good.

It's in the Laketown book (page 12, 'Go to the Market-pool' specifically). The GM Screen comes with it. I highly recommend it.

I am not sure, but he WAS trying to do a lot of stuff he wasnt skilled in and failing rolls. Hes a regular gamer with us so it was suprising to see him react and play like this. He probably just needs time. EDIT: Just spoke to my other dwarf player and he feels every other races rewards and virtues are better. He feels all the dwarfs have going for them is the Stiff Neck of the Dwarves ability allowing them to add their shadow score to common skill rolls.

Uh...they have a base Travel of 3. Travel is likely the best (or at least most rolled) skill in the entire game. They get to wear heavier armor than anyone else at less encumbrance while simultaneously having the highest Endurance in the game.

As for Rewards, Helm of Awe is amazing if you raise your Awe, the Axe is actually really good, and the generic weapon qualities are all solid choices. That's as many good Rewards as most cultures get.

And in terms of Virtues, Broken Spells is situational, but nice upon occasion, Raven of the Mountains is super useful for scouting and message delivery, Durin's Way is awesome if you spend a lot of time underground (which you admittedly likely don't), Old Hatred is absolutely spectacular given how often Orcs get fought, and Stiff Neck of the Dwarves probably vies with Twice-Baked Honey Cakes and Hound of Mirkwood for best Virtue in the game. Again, that's a decent spread as compared to other Cultures.

Beornings, for example, have Twice baked Honey Cakes, which is amazing, Skin-Coat and Great Strength which are really good, and Night Walker and Brother to Bears which are situational at best. And for Rewards, Noble Armor is amazing, while the Giant Slaying Spear and the Splitting Axe are only okay. That's very comparable to the Dwarven set IMO.

Now, as starting characters, Dwarves are also very specialized in Common Skills, being good at Craft, Travel, Search, and adequate at Explore, Inspire, and Riddle, and bad at anything else...but that's what AP are for. Buy up those low skills and you wind up feeling a lot more effective real soon.

And all the cultures have the same number of skill 'points', so everyone kinda sucks to start with. At least Dwarves start off good at some stuff.

That is what I wanted to do, but we are already on the third adventure so I am not sure if I can start incorporating the events from darkening of mirkwood.

Should be pretty doable. I don't know details of DoM (spoilers and all), but we completed ToW, and I don't think we had more than a handful of DoW things between the first three adventures.

[zedturtle]

Treasure:

In general, The One Ring worries about money as much as Bilbo or Frodo did... that is to say, not very often. But there are a few things you can do with Treasure:

• Raise Standard of Living: 1 Treasure per month at Prosperous or 2 Treasure per month at Rich. This unlocks better provisions, hiring boats and ponies.
• Raise Standing: Costs lots of Treasure, allows heroes to dictate more of Years' End activities.
• Maintain Standing: Necessary to spend Treasure when you're not at home (or somewhere you've received a Title).
• Weregild: If you've slain a person, it's customary to pay weregild to their family for their loss. See Lake-town Sourcebook.
• Markets: Both Lake-town and Horse-lords have pricing for horses*, and Lake-town has pricing for livestock.
• Holdings: Can produce Treasure for heroes. See Darkening of Mirkwood.

Dwarves:

I have a couple of players who play nothing but dwarves (including one dwarf who has been through all of Tales and is present in Darkening). Stiff Neck has actually gotten little play (though in one game with a high XP dwarf it's been pretty impressive), but Raven of the Mountains is extraordinarily useful (especially for the LM as a hint machine on wings). I also like Broken Spells, though of course you need to find ways to make it useful without straining believability (the best use of Prohibition and Exclusion was when a dwarf player cast that on a narrow spit of land that connected an island to the mainland, thus preventing the escape of an enemy).

As mentioned above, Redoubtable, high Travel and very good Endurance means that dwarves are tough mudders. I hope your player keeps at it... once you get Mattock up to 4 dice or more then dwarves are about the best 1-shot 1-kill machines for line troops (especially if Old Hatred is in play).

Tales to Darkening:

We played through most all of Tales before transitioning into Darkening. Some players retired their heroes (and one died/disappeared** during the conclusion of Tales), but several heroes kept going. They tend to do a little better in simple fights than I expect, but the tangled webs of politics and the decline of the Woodmen are not something that having a high Sword skill or even a high Courtesy skill can completely remedy.

I would say it's fine to move heroes from one to the other, though I would emphasise to the players that it's expected that heroes will retire during the course of Darkening... it's a thirty year campaign, it's not realistic for all the heroes to stay active the entire time.

—•—•—•—•—•—•—•—•—•—•—•—•—•—•—•—•—•—•—

* Note that a riding horse is cheaper in the North than in Rohan. I suspect that's what called a riding horse in the north would be considered nothing more than a better than average packhorse in Rohan.

** [avatar]It was very confusing[/avatar]

[Glorelendil]

Does the dissatisfaction with Dwarves have anything to do with an over-emphasis on combat? Because, yeah, they don't really have a virtue or reward that boosts damage output. But in general Keen/Fell/Grievous are great choices, especially on a Mattock. And Intimidate Foe is about the best combat task you can take, so the Helm is great, too.

[Arinbor]

Does the dissatisfaction with Dwarves have anything to do with an over-emphasis on combat? Because, yeah, they don't really have a virtue or reward that boosts damage output. But in general Keen/Fell/Grievous are great choices, especially on a Mattock. And Intimidate Foe is about the best combat task you can take, so the Helm is great, too.

I believe so. Most of my players come from combat heavy RPGs such as Pathfinder and DnD. I try to encourage a lot of RP between characters and NPCs, but it is hard to break them out of the "I just want to roll to convince this guy" without telling me what they want to say. I feel the this system is very RP and interaction heavy and they havent gotten that through their heads yet.

I have a couple of players who play nothing but dwarves (including one dwarf who has been through all of Tales and is present in Darkening). Stiff Neck has actually gotten little play (though in one game with a high XP dwarf it's been pretty impressive), but Raven of the Mountains is extraordinarily useful (especially for the LM as a hint machine on wings). I also like Broken Spells, though of course you need to find ways to make it useful without straining believability (the best use of Prohibition and Exclusion was when a dwarf player cast that on a narrow spit of land that connected an island to the mainland, thus preventing the escape of an enemy).

This backs up what I said before about being RP heavy as well as thinking outside of the box. I think I just need to encourage players to interact with each other more outside of just thinking "well, Im rolling to do this. Why do I need to tell you what I'm saying." That may seem harsh, but I like to know the context of what the palyer is trying to get across and how he is doing it. Simple folk, my group. Not enough meta for them methinks.

[zedturtle]

I can't believe I get to say this before Glorelendil for once: The One Ring works great if you have players roll and then narrate the results. Let them roll to convince the guy and then say: "You just got an Extraordinary success; tell me what you said that won the Captain of the Guard over" or "You just failed with the Eye of Sauron showing*... something bad happened, tell me what went wrong."

You'll probably need to guide them a little bit, but it's a lot of fun to tell stories about how you really mucked something up or came through in a pinch.

- - -

* This isn't an official rule, but whenever the Eye shows up, I always try to work some sort of complication in, just for fun.

[Glorelendil]

I can't believe I get to say this before Glorelendil for once: The One Ring works great if you have players roll and then narrate the results. Let them roll to convince the guy and then say: "You just got an Extraordinary success; tell me what you said that won the Captain of the Guard over" or "You just failed with the Eye of Sauron showing*... something bad happened, tell me what went wrong."

You'll probably need to guide them a little bit, but it's a lot of fun to tell stories about how you really mucked something up or came through in a pinch.

Dang, you beat me to it. But, yeah, that. They don't even have to "act" it out; just have them narrate it.

This is better than "narrate, then roll" because you don't have to decide how good the roleplaying was, and how much of a bonus (or penalty) it should be worth. There are no subjective LM decisions.

Also, it's a house rule, but I allow invoking (and narrating) traits on Sauron fails to earn an AP. "Because I'm Suspicious I refused to give him my name, making my Persuade go pretty badly."