What is "home" for Dwarves of the Grey Mountains?

[Falenthal]

I think being homeless is probably the best idea and the most interesting.
That said, I think i would go with this:

-They don't have a home, so every Undertaking that has the "return home" requirement can't be taken (There and Back Again, for example). Also, the benefits of going home for some Undertakings (Heal Corruption) can't be had (if refugees can't heal corruption at the same rate as others, that's why they look a bit "off" to other people. Like Frár and the brothers Pillum and Pollum or whatever).
Once they get a Sanctuary, this problem is partially solved.

-Their Standing works as ususal, but of course only among other Grey Mountain Dwarves. They might do yearly meetings among all of their scaterred folk, to discuss the findings they've made regarding the recovery of their ancestral homes, to share stories about their former glory, to plan for the retaking of them,... In such meetings, Standing can be used as ever to take part in the discussions and decissions.

Any other uses a "home" has?

[Otaku-sempai]

We could use here some clarification from a member of the development team, but I think it is inaccurate to say that a Dwarf of the Grey Mountains should be considered to be homeless. Even if such a Hero-character goes home only to find the rude shack or cave-system in which he was born to be destroyed or abandoned. he still has a home in the broader sense within the community of the Dwarves of the Grey Mountains--scattered though it may be.

[Kullervo]

I am inclined to think that for a Grey Mountains dwarf to get a 'home', they'd just have to do the 'Enter Erebor' thing, and since they have Craft 3 and are a dwarf, it should be fine. I'd count it as their home for the purposes of mechanics and rolls, since Thror and Gror both lived at Grey Mountains before this, so... yeah. At most, I'd ask for a Fellowship Phase to be spent settling into their new Home. But, Erebor does have that corruption test to deal with now, for people of the Treasure-Hunter Calling, so I can see how some would not want that.

[Brocktoon]

We could use here some clarification from a member of the development team, but I think it is inaccurate to say that a Dwarf of the Grey Mountains should be considered to be homeless. Even if such a Hero-character goes home only to find the rude shack or cave-system in which he was born to be destroyed or abandoned. he still has a home in the broader sense within the community of the Dwarves of the Grey Mountains--scattered though it may be.

Yeah, I'd love to get an official word here. Not that the suggestions aren't good (they are!), but because the concept of home is integral to the way the game is presented and the way the rules are shaped. Not always in huge ways, but there's a difference between home, the place you spend your time, and HOME, the place linked to Standing, Fellowship undertakings, etc. The former is endlessly mutable based on campaign needs; the latter is a concrete rules based foundation of the game.

Assuming no official input, I'd most likely defer to the idea that they just meet at some weird dwarf moot every year or something.

[Otaku-sempai]

I am inclined to think that for a Grey Mountains dwarf to get a 'home', they'd just have to do the 'Enter Erebor' thing, and since they have Craft 3 and are a dwarf, it should be fine. I'd count it as their home for the purposes of mechanics and rolls, since Thror and Gror both lived at Grey Mountains before this, so... yeah. At most, I'd ask for a Fellowship Phase to be spent settling into their new Home. But, Erebor does have that corruption test to deal with now, for people of the Treasure-Hunter Calling, so I can see how some would not want that.

Sorry, I disagree. For this to be true then a Grey Mountains Dwarf would have had to relocate to Erebor in the same way that Durin's Folk in the Blue Mountains relocated to Erebor following the Battle of Five Armies. If the Dwarf was not dwelling in Erebor at the start of the game then he (or she) is not a Dwarf of Erebor for game-purposes. His home is in the Grey Mountains, not Lonely Mountain.

[Kullervo]

I am inclined to think that for a Grey Mountains dwarf to get a 'home', they'd just have to do the 'Enter Erebor' thing, and since they have Craft 3 and are a dwarf, it should be fine. I'd count it as their home for the purposes of mechanics and rolls, since Thror and Gror both lived at Grey Mountains before this, so... yeah. At most, I'd ask for a Fellowship Phase to be spent settling into their new Home. But, Erebor does have that corruption test to deal with now, for people of the Treasure-Hunter Calling, so I can see how some would not want that.

Sorry, I disagree. For this to be true then a Grey Mountains Dwarf would have had to relocate to Erebor in the same way that Durin's Folk in the Blue Mountains relocated to Erebor following the Battle of Five Armies. If the Dwarf was not dwelling in Erebor at the start of the game then he (or she) is not a Dwarf of Erebor for game-purposes. His home is in the Grey Mountains, not Lonely Mountain.

No reason to apologize for disagreement, heh, thats why its a forum. That said, considering Grey Mountains is where dwarves went from Erebor to, I will stick to my interpretation. They may not have lived there long enough to mark themselves as 'of Erebor', but think about this: Smaug is only dead for... five years, when most adventures begin? That means they only lived there for 5 years, some even less, and they came from all over. Heck, even Balin is a dwarf of Grey Mountains, and now his home is Erebor. He's certainly no wandering craftsman, anymore. If you wish to play it by the unwritten rules of the whole 5 year thing, then by that logic, after the dwarf of Grey Mountians spends 5 years in Erebor in a dwelling they acquired thanks to their craft, they are considered as a resident - same as the others.

[Otaku-sempai]

No reason to apologize for disagreement, heh, thats why its a forum. That said, considering Grey Mountains is where dwarves went from Erebor to, I will stick to my interpretation. They may not have lived there long enough to mark themselves as 'of Erebor', but think about this: Smaug is only dead for... five years, when most adventures begin? That means they only lived there for 5 years, some even less, and they came from all over. Heck, even Balin is a dwarf of Grey Mountains, and now his home is Erebor. He's certainly no wandering craftsman, anymore. If you wish to play it by the unwritten rules of the whole 5 year thing, then by that logic, after the dwarf of Grey Mountians spends 5 years in Erebor in a dwelling they acquired thanks to their craft, they are considered as a resident - same as the others.

There is a problem with your chain of reasoning: Durin's Folk in the Blue Mountains left Erebor much more recently than many of the Dwarves of the Grey Mountains (TA 2770 versus 2210). Balin and Thorin were both born in Erebor. All of Thorin's other companions among the Dwarves were presumably born in Dunland (Dwalin, Óin and Glóin) or, after the year 2802, the Blue Mountains (Fili and Kili for certain). Fili and Kili would have belonged to the Culture of the Dwarves of the Blue Mountains, as would most of the others until after they came to reside in Erebor.

You are certainly correct that in 2946 the Dwarves of Erebor is a very young Culture made up primarily of former Dwarves of the Blue Mountains and Iron Hills. It wouldn't be until at least 2992 that any Dwarves born there since Dáin became King under the Mountain would even reach the nominal age of adulthood (50 years). Any Dwarf of the Grey Mountains who came to permanently reside in Lonely Mountain would be considered to belong to the Culture of Erebor, no longer one of the Dwarves of the Grey Mountains. At least that is how I interpret it.

[Otaku-sempai]

2) On page 11, regarding entering and living in Erebor, it makes a distinction between dwarves of the Mountain and those not. Those not can move in (with Crafting 3, which all dwarves have, so that's weird but I can roll with it), but that means that there are dwarves who aren't using Erebor as a cultural homeland.

I think that this nails it: In addition to the Dwarves of Erebor there are other Dwarven Heroic Cultures: the Dwarves of the Blue Mountains (to be detailed in The Adventurer’s Companion); Dwarves of the Grey Mountains; Dwarves of the Iron Hills; and possibly others such as the various Dwarf-kingdoms of Rhûn. All those Dwarves have cultural homelands that are not Erebor although some of them might be counted as Durin's Folk and even have ancestors from Erebor. The others can relocate and become Dwarves of Erebor, but that is not their native Culture. This is what happened with Durin's Folk of the Blue Mountains and the Iron Hills.

[Falenthal]

Would you allow a Grey Mountains Dwarf to take part in the Year's End events that happen in Erebor, considering their Standing rating? Or is that Standing only usable for events related to Grey Mountains Dwarves? In that case, Erebor is not their "Home".

Should a Grey Mountain then receive the Title for being a Lonely Mountain Dwarf, or is he considered one?

This are other kind of questions that can answer how you want to relate the Grey Mountain Dwarves to Erebor.

[DavetheLost]

I think if the Dwarves of the Grey Mountains were "Home-less" in terms of the rules this would be called out. It is not and there are a number of rules that require or assume that all characters have a "Home". Where and what that home is need not be precisely defined.

The Dwarves of Erebor are clearly a different unit to the Dwarves of the Grey Mountains, the Blue Mountains, or the Iron Hills. Just as the Men of Laketown are different to the Men of Dale, the Woodmen, and the Beornings.

I would say that Dwarves who do not begin play as "Dwarves of the Lonely Mountain" are not. They must Enter Erebor and achieve status there.