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The Rivendell source books says:The difference is that it takes longer for a Ranger or a High Elf hero to improve his abilities.

I know C7 is attempting to keep game balance with handicapping ( sorry in grumpy mood) the two unique cultures I can understand the thought process with regaining hope and shadow accumulation as the reasons are given in the book that gives a thematic answer as to why, but besides mechanically hindering them I haven't found a good ( imo) reason for the slow progress as I don't think there is one given in the book. Most of the responses I get else were are they are training for perfection in there skills so it takes longer. I feel rather meh about that explanation.

Anyone else's thoughts on this?

Their wisdom and knowledge means that it takes more real life experience to actual impact their skills. In game terms you can't really reward fractional experience points, so things cost more XP. It all works out.

A character that lives longer and has that much power, should see things in another perspective. The problem with that reasoning is that the wood elves and and the dwarves....live long too.

My main perspective is that a Ranger of the Dunadain and the High Elf especially take a heavier toll mentally with their problems of the shadow. Their lives tend to be more grim than the other adventurers. I think they just mentally have a harder time freeing their mind to learn efficiently because of that. They are under much harder stress and burden of responsability. They are under much harder pressure from the shadow, and they feel the shadow threat because they KNOW the Shadow is after their utter destruction.

Southron Loremaster wrote:Anyone else's thoughts on this?

Get rid of it then you at least know that 30 XP spent on a Ranger is the same as 30 XP spent on another character culture and that those other cultures won't catch up and surpass him in weapon skills and Valour/Wisdom ratings if they've had the same XP awarded to them.

Southron Loremaster wrote:besides mechanically hindering them I haven't found a good ( imo) reason for the slow progress as I don't think there is one given in the book.

I feel the same. Right now, I don't consider that Rangers and High Elves are a "superior" culture in mechanical terms. They have hindraces that other cultures don't have and that makes the balance even (more or less).

Also, I too can't find a reason why their Valour and Wisdom should rise slower than other cultures. Can't be related to the lifespan, as Mirkwood Elves and Erebor Dwarves have the same long lifespans.
The Virtues and Rewards are mostly superior to those of other cultures, but if they can be gained at a slower rate, then they become even once again.
Besides, Rangers and High Elves will have a tendency to fail more Fear and Corruption tests (Valour and Wisdom) than other cultures because their scores will increase slower than those of the rest of the group. This doesn't make a lot of sense to me, at least thematically. Also in Encounters their ratings won't be as important as those of their comrades.

On the other side, regarding Encounters, both cultures can have a bonus if choosing certain Virtues (Royalty Revealed and Beaty of the Stars). Failing Corruption or Fear tests leads to bad consequences regarding Hope and Shadow, which is the weak spot of both cultures, and thus could even fit thematically. And although the rate of gaining Virtues and Rewards is slower, the fact that they are more powerful might make up for it.

I don't know, I still haven't made up my mind about what to think of the higher XP cost. I'd probably dump it off if I were to have Rangers and High Elves in a campaign. But might not be so bad as it seems.

Thank you all for your responses.

Rich H wrote:

Southron Loremaster wrote:Anyone else's thoughts on this?

Get rid of it then you at least know that 30 XP spent on a Ranger is the same as 30 XP spent on another character culture and that those other cultures won't catch up and surpass him in weapon skills and Valour/Wisdom ratings if they've had the same XP awarded to them.

Hello Rich, your suggestion holds and is what my response would probably be, however, I may not have been clear in my original post and was wondering about the reasons for the slower EP/AP as there were reasons given for their hope and shadow point hindrances but none given for these.

Maybe we need a thread in House Rules to discuss ways to adjust Dunedain and Noldor. I have to admit that after playing a Ranger for a little while I've lost interest in that culture, which is disappointing because I was excited for it. The inability to replenish Hope and the steeper XP costs were just too punishing.

Southron Loremaster wrote:Hello Rich, your suggestion holds and is what my response would probably be, however, I may not have been clear in my original post and was wondering about the reasons for the slower EP/AP as there were reasons given for their hope and shadow point hindrances but none given for these.

Apologies, I didn't give an explanation because I can't honestly think of one that makes any sense. Elves of Mirkwood are immortal and Dwarves are just as long-lived as a Ranger so it can't be anything to do with that. It just feels like a balancing mechanic for the sake of balancing.

Glorelendil wrote:The inability to replenish Hope and the steeper XP costs were just too punishing.

Agreed. I do think the Hope restriction on its own is enough; it also really shuts them off as an option to players not familiar with the TOR rules as not having access to the Fellowship pool dynamically changes a major facet of the game mechanics.