Elven Cloak vs. Stealth

[greysearcher]

Sorry if this question has already been answered, but I was wondering how using an Elf of Lorien's Elven Cloak is any different from using the stealth skill without it? As I read it, either way, a stealth check is required and the end result seems to be about the same. Am I missing something?

[Glorelendil]

A normal Stealth check would be made vs. a TN determined by circumstances, which might vary depending on who you are hiding from. And you might have to make several checks depending on the situation.

With an Elven Cloak you make the roll beforehand, but it's always against TN 14. And if you succeed you no longer have to make any additional rolls, regardless of who wanders by.

My personal opinion is that it needs a slight buff. It's flavorful and even useful but underpowered relative to lots of other choices. The situations where you want to stealth without moving are probably in the minority. Compare to Feathered Armour, which gives you a fat bonus every time you Stealth.

[Stormcrow]

Good question! I'd guess it's the extent to which an elven cloak allows the wearer to remain unnoticed no matter what those around him do. The Loremaster might make someone using Stealth roll multiple tasks if enemies are moving around in the area, but someone wearing an elven cloak would only need to roll once.

[cuthalion]

Agree with Glorelendil and Stormcrow.

Plus, I hope this isn't stating the obvious, but an Elven Cloak would seem to allow for hiding under ANY circumstances ("when you are in the wilderness")--i.e. even in terrain or a scenario where a LM might not normally allow for stealth/hiding at all, or in situations in which there wouldn't be time to find a hiding spot. Could be pretty handy . . .

[Stormcrow]

Furthermore, "cloaks that hide their wearers from observing eyes" are listed as an example of a Wondrous Artefact in Rivendell. One is given in the Magical Treasure Index for the pre-generated characters: "A cloak of Elven make, the weave of which magically allows the wearer to blend seamlessly into his surroundings (a Blessing to Stealth)." This item allows the wearer to add his Wisdom to his Stealth roll OR achieve a Magical Result by spending a point of Hope. This is MUCH more potent than the Elf of Lorien's Cloak, which is said to be made by the Lady of Lorien herself.

Something is clearly amiss here.

[Falenthal]

I don't know what to think about this Reward. My first impression was that it was too weak. As Stormcrow said, specially compared to the Wondrous Artifact that appeared in Rivendell.

I have the feeling that this is one of those Rewards (and specially Virtues) that are as powerful as the player can imagine, and the LM allows. Like The Speakers, or Natural Watchfulness (from Woodmen), they give abilities that are not flat bonuses, but a chance for interpretation and creativity. If the player is able to come up with situations where the ability grants an edge or allows for something otherwise impossible, and the LM allows for it, then it might turn into a superb Reward. Otherwise, if you only want the Elven Cloack to do better Stealth rolls, then that's not the Reward you were looking for.

That said, and as much as I love this kind of Virtues in TOR (The Speakers is one of my favourite powers), I'm having a very hard time visualizing situations where the Elven Cloack would become an atonishing Reward compared to others.

[greysearcher]

Thanks for the replies everyone, Some good ideas out there!

[BELERION]

I have made a "homemaid rule" about this item : I consider it as a Wonderous Artifact.

[Elmoth]

An elven cloak might be useful for small parties (even single characters) travelling in the wild, allowing them to avoid nasty encounters while they sleep and such

Cheers,
Xavi

[cuthalion]

It crossed my mind too that there is a bit of a discrepancy between the reward in AC and the suggested artifact in Rivendell. But I think it's pretty understandably--no other starting culture gets a magical item (unlike the advanced cultures). I think LMs/groups could adopt whichever version of the cloak they all agree on easily.

Since it specifically says it's made by Galadriel, I think I would choose the wondrous artifact version, personally. The basic reward also doesn't cover that the cloaks in the books hid the users at least somewhat at all times, even when not sitting still etc., as when the three hunters are walking through Rohan, or Merry and Pippin are glimpsed from afar at Isengard, etc., etc. Seems like the general boost to stealth makes more sense. Plus the chance for it to be truly magical.