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Hey, i'm looking for feedback to a short term idea i have for my character i'm playing in a local game of TOR.

I will set the scene first so you understand the "internal party conflict".

During a fellowship phase, my party consisting of Dwarf 1 (me), Dwarf 2 and a Beorning were involved in friendly melee, free for all, last man standing contest based in Dale. Having fought our way as a team through the rounds, it eventually settled down to my group to fight it out between us to see who would win the contest. Both myself and Dwarf 2 were weary with about half endurance each while the Beorning was practically on full endurance. I then turned to my fellow Dwarf kin for aid in taking down the Beorning in front of an open crowd. Dwarf 2 however was more interested in deciding between us who would win the contest with the 2 others submitting, but splitting the large chest of goods evenly. After some debating i pushed my point that if we did this, it would look very unsporting and we would get booed from the field, though i was still happy to split the winnings if we fought it out for a clear winner. Playing a Dwarf, i felt that we needed to fight it out so we could get an honourable outright winner. So having taken this onboard, Dwarf 2 then decides to follow up on the Beornings attack on me, to hit me KO'ing me from the fight, with me unable to make any response as i was going third in initiative. He then decides that he wants to throw his weapon away from him to show he submits. Thankfully our GM let the Beorning make an athletics roll (which he passed) to allow the Beorning to make an attack on Dwarf 2 before he tried to throw his weapon away. The resulting attack did succeed KO'ing Dwarf 2, leaving the Beorning the winner of the contest.

So, due to the previous event, whereby infront of the public, which included many other Dwarfs as it was an large festival, i requested the aid of my kin to take down the enemy, he decides to blindside me with an attack (as in character, i wouldn't be expecting it and he gave no indication that he refused the idea in character), I was thinking of roleplaying my character with a short term grudge due to currently possessing 4 shadow points. This grudge would pass when I eventually clear my 4 outstanding shadow points on my character. I felt that as Dwarves, we should automatically band as a race to take on the enemy, especially since we didn't have a Dwarf representing amongst the other winners from the other events (which were an Elf for archery, Beorning for wrestling, Dale Human for horse back spearing/throwing).

The grudge wouldn't involve anything that would cause harm to Dwarf 2, but my character would act disagreeable, stubborn and petty when interacting when with him for the most part (unless i out rightly agree with him on things that are logical). I wouldn't accept his help or offer mine (unless the situation direly needs it), nor would i trust him with anything. I would also look to start a rumor of Dwarf 2 being untrustworthy through my standing with Erebor and when possible. I'd possibly even look to leave him on the short end in situations if i have control of them and try to show him up/humiliate him.

I'd like to know what people think of this short term idea? Am i taking things too far or would you say it's an interesting & realistic direction to take my character and his relationship with Dwarf 2 on a short term basis? I would appreciate any suggestions on things i could do when roleplaying it out aswell? For example, I was thinking of referring to him as "The Betrayer of Dwarves" or just "The Betrayer" whenever i can, especially in public. I would however, expect there to be negative effects on me (and possibly my group) if i happen to botch a roll when i'm showing my grudge, as the grudge shouldn't out rightly only effect Dwarf 2.

I would run it by my LM as it could degenerate and kill the game, but -overall- the grudge idea would make sense.

I don't fully agree with you that as Dwarfs you should automatically band together -unless you are Kin or of the same tribe, but his action does warant a Grudge as he proved himself untrustworthy and maybe a bit cowardly. Anf your idea here:

but my character would act disagreeable, stubborn and petty when interacting when with him for the most part (unless i out rightly agree with him on things that are logical). I wouldn't accept his help or offer mine (unless the situation direly needs it), nor would i trust him with anything

Seems perfectly suitable for it.


The Rumors and calling his a "Betrayer" is pushing it a bit too far IMHO as he never agreed to help you, he simply chosed to ignore your offer and then beat you to a pulp.

That's my 2 copper pieces

Sounds fitting, but, as suggested, running it with your group (npt jst the LM) and lakg sure they agree os a top priority, since that might change how you play some scenes in the game. Sounds like fun in any case

I also think calling him betrayer may be a bit much... and that running it past your Loremaster is an excellent idea

I would sinish by addinf it would be good to clarify out of character that the your dwarf is in the wrong; that the petty spitefulness and grudge is the work of the shadow, and it will lessen over time as he realises that and the shadow's hold also lessens; that way the other Player (but not character) will be clear you are only role-playing an IC grudge and not an OCC grudge, as what happened on the field seem reasonable overall - just not for your character

I did run it by with my GM and he agreed it was fine. I asked the same questions about Dwarves and sticking together and he said yes and no as they will band together but they wouldn't band with a Dwarf who was evil or they didn't like whatsoever. For me, i feel that publicly asking for his help infront of many other Dwarves who know of us and siding with the Beorning, preventing a greater chance for a Dwarf winning an event, would look indeed bad for him. His only saving grace was that the Beorning KO'd him before he could throw his weapon away making people believe the Beorning won the fight fairly and preventing him from looking both out rightly cowardly and untrustworthy amongst everyone who was watching.

I won't be telling the remaining group as they can figure it out for themselves or can ask my Dwarf/me why he is acting up. I feel telling them that he's holding a grudge would retract from the game as they'll use out of game information in game, when we can roleplay it out as personally, we don't have an issue with each other and are friends. One other thing, i did mention to him OOC when debating what we should do to decide the winner, I said there would be a negative outcome if he went ahead with his plan. I just didn't specify that my Dwarf would be the one negatively affected by his actions over what the GM would decide upon. Had the GM decided to negatively affect Dwarf 2, my Dwarf wouldn't hold a grudge as he would feel that he got him comeuppance.

I think it is a good way of roleplaying my shadow as previously i didn't really hold a way to show it other than maybe coming across as stubborn.

I've taken on your feedback too. I will scale it back gradually as i've already began calling him "The Betrayer". When i happen to lose atleast 1 shadow, i will scale it back to just being...

but my character would act disagreeable, stubborn and petty when interacting when with him for the most part (unless i out rightly agree with him on things that are logical). I wouldn't accept his help or offer mine (unless the situation direly needs it), nor would i trust him with anything

...but for the immediate short term, i think it's suiting since my character is showing his pettyness in the present right after the event. The rumour i feel i will need to discuss further with the GM as i felt it was a good idea but i don't want it to have an overbearing affect in the long term.

This game is not about PvP.

fbnaulin wrote:This game is not about PvP.

Expand what you mean?

It has not mechanics that support or encourage player versus player conflict. The game is designed to do one thing in wonderful manner: heroic ventures in Middle-earth. It's a very rewarding game if you play it as it is. Don't fight against the rules.

To the contrary...interparty conflict IS classic Tolkien.

Boromir vs. Frodo come to mind, and that's before we get into other books...

You are right, and we have bout of madness rules to this kind of scenes. Thanks for remembering. Anyway, I was refering to proactive combat between companions.