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Mordjinn wrote: Reviewing the rulebooks and Tales from Wilderland I understood one reason for me not getting a real good grasp of the system combined with storytelling. The rulebook doesn't really give you good written examples with engaging storytelling. For example in combat example of Loremaster's book p.50 reads:

Well, it's true that there is a a sort of presumption that most of those people who buy the game are already well adversed in roleplaying games that mirror this type of mood, or have experienced it, or at the very least has one or two gamers who are familiar and comfortable with it. Just like a manual you buy for your Ford Mustang has certain assumptions that an owner of said car, already knows how to drive.

The game is a 'rule book' to play the game. For tutorials of how to play roleplaying games, there are forums like this, and books and other sites that have all sorts of tutorials, and teachings for how to play interactive games like this.

The important and good thing is though that you and your group are not deterred despite the slow-start, and want to learn to enjoy it. It only gets better from here; and in the end, you'll have a new perspective and respect for less crunchy roleplaying games to get more from less, and you can carry that skill over to all sorts of other genres and games that follow a similar design.

If anyone has ideas/recommendations how to make the rest of the Don't leave the Path more exciting they would be highly appreciated. I think if I can make this scenario really take off we will continue happily and get a chance to experience TOR in all its glory.

Honestly, one of the (hardest) best things you can do for yourself and your game (if you are LM) is learn the source material. I'm talking about reading the books on Tolkien's world. I was a fan of the main books, but was not a scholar at all on anything of the world past the LOTR and Hobbit. But I started reading websites wikis, and stuff on webrings on Middle-earth, and have significantly improved our gaming experience by being better able to draw inspiration from what I know of the world.

A few other big tips I have for you

1) during the "cut-scenes" that I described to you (when making the Travel checks), I used that time to speak the heroes as the father and son due - each time, allowing the heroes to learn more about them. This creates a stronger bond, and the players gain a vested interest in their survival beyond the scope of just "this is the quest were suppose to be on". It also makes for a greater impact later when it's so obvious that they only have each other, and the father loses all memory of his son, and son resents him for it later.

2) I always manage to throw a few plot hooks for future adventure ideas. Every Journey they are on, they learn at least 3 other things that may make the heroes want to learn/know more about something. It could be something they find, a set of ruins, a rumor, a song, riddle, a bizarre plant/creature that is not indigenous, or an NPC that they meet that asks them to "visit him next time they're in Dale." I allow the players to figure out what is important to them to follow up on and that drives the next plot/adventure. Again, having a great knowledge of the source material helps. When reading the web right (Tolkien Gateway is one of my favorite websites) i just pick a random thing to read about and then click on the links to read more and more about something and I find all sorts of things to add into the game.

3) Drop foreshadowing for future TfW adventures. During the fighting with the spiders, I had a group of elves who are part of Legolas scouting party, show up to help the heroes. They had the noldor elf gal from the next adventure with them. Later when on that adventure (can't remember the title of the adventure at the moment) they'll see the same elves and Legolas will finally meet them, and ask their help.

4) Someone on here once suggested asking questions of the player characters, that help link the characters to the storyline. I wish I could find that link. Anyways, if there's a hobbit in the group - ask them about Dindy - "There is a Hobbit named Dindy you remember from the Shire. He had a dream of travelling one day. What was your relationship with Dindy like and why?" Later they meet Dindy. These really attach the heroes to the story. Perhaps you can ask one of the characters how they were personally affected by Lake-town's destruction by Smaug (like the father/son were in the story). Then during one of the cut-scenes, there can be conversation that realizes that they have such similar backgrounds.

Robert

3)

SirKicley wrote: 4) Someone on here once suggested asking questions of the player characters, that help link the characters to the storyline. I wish I could find that link.

viewtopic.php?f=7&t=113&start=70

That's my re-post of the original.

Elfcrusher wrote:

SirKicley wrote: 4) Someone on here once suggested asking questions of the player characters, that help link the characters to the storyline. I wish I could find that link.

viewtopic.php?f=7&t=113&start=70

That's my re-post of the original.

Major kudos to Elf-crusher for providing that! Thank you so much. I enjoyed re-reading that one.

SirKicley wrote:I would say that it was both foreshadowing - based on Gandalf's intuitive nature that is party due to him being a wizard; and a lesson to Frodo. A lesson that Frodo took to heart, and was better for it as he wound up not fulfilling his task, and Gollum was a necessary part to finish the deed.

It's a central theme in all of Tolkien's Middle-earth: every evil deed has evil consequences, without exception, and yet evil will still have been good to have been. If either Bilbo or Frodo had taken the easier, safer way out and killed Gollum, Middle-earth would have been doomed because when Frodo reached Mount Doom he would have claimed the Ring and been caught by Sauron. This isn't just irony or a unique coincidence; this is the Christian worldview of Tolkien and it is everywhere in Middle-earth.

Yes, thank you for that link. This is a great idea & every LM should do something like this to draw your players in to their heroes & adventures.

BTW, Stormcrow makes an insightful observation concerning the themes & balance in Middle-earth. Ideally, these should permeate every adventure, which I believe the RAW do beautifully.

Almost 25y experience mastering DnD, but still scared from one ring roleplay
Great topic here, helps me understand how rp is intended in TOR

Artyus wrote:Almost 25y experience mastering DnD, but still scared from one ring roleplay
Great topic here, helps me understand how rp is intended in TOR

Not scary - think of it as reverse-engineering. The rules and modifiers etc are already in place in D&D. Why are they there? Because you met some predetermined criteria. "I get +2 because I'm charging/flanking/higherground" whatever. "I nearly have an auto-success in my skill check because the favorable conditions provide circumstance modifiers of +2 because I'm the same race/clan/culture, he wants to believe me, we're in ideal situation, I have masterwork grapple and rope, I have a perfect handhold riddled wall section to climb" etc. All of things are suggested circumstance modifiers for typical skill tests in D&D.

Now for TOR - you have the modifiers in the way of which stance your in. So just use reverse engineering. I HAVE this lower TN to hit because I'm......(fill in the blank) and narrate it accordingly.

Or you invoke a trait garnering an auto-success because....(fill in the blank) and narrate how the circumstances are in your favor and how your trait allows you to excel at that task.


It's no different in the end how the result turns out - it's just an abstract way of explaining how the dynamics of the rules are situated for you at that moment - although in D&D they provide the groundwork of what HAS to be present to get the bonus, in TOR (and other rules-light games), the opportunities for increased success are present, but the reasons are not; you just have to come up with said reasons for it from an unlimited (limited only by your imagination and common sense) number of possibilities.

Reverse engineering. Start with the bonus/benefit- and arrive at a justification. Not start with the criteria justification (IF present) and take the bonus/benefit from it.

Robert

SirKicley wrote:A few other big tips I have for you

Thanks once again. Amazing tips which will improve my loremastering a lot. I also purchased both Heart of the Wild and Darkening of Mirkwood yesterday to get in depth understanding of the setting. Will check Tolkien Gateway for sure too.

I'm also tempted at least to try to make the combat more easily approachable for my group by introducing some tactical battle map during combat. It might make the transition easier and once we get a better grasp of the system we can drop the them if it doesn't work for us.

The One Ring requires some rules changes if you're going to try to play a battle with miniatures. Here are some suggestions.

The rules don't take movement speeds into account at all. To handle this, allow any character or creature to move as far as they want on the play surface—but in a single round, they can change direction no more than ninety degrees. This will let them go in the general direction they want, without being able to abuse movement freedom by running rings around any obstacle.

All combatants are assumed to be completely free to rotate to any direction at any time and as often as they want. This prevents attempts to run behind your foe while it stupidly stands there facing the wrong direction.

Stances should be declared before movement takes place. Then all movement on both sides must take place before any stances are resolved. Some special circumstances, like performing the Protect Companion task, will only work if the character performing them is in the general vicinity of the target. The referee must make sure that enemies spread out to attack each hero, as per the rules.

To attack a foe, you need to be kinda-sorta close to it, to be judged by the referee. Forward stance characters should be touching their foes. Open and defensive stance characters can be close without touching. Rearward stance characters can be anywhere outside this range. Exactly how far these ranges are depends on the size of the play area and its scale.

The play area need not be gridded, since there is little need to measure distances. There is a table of ranges for ranged weapons in the Adventurer's Guide, p. 115, but there doesn't seem to be any rule applying these range categories, so they can safely be ignored.

A character who takes advantage of an extra die from a Battle roll is finding something not already indicated in the play area, but which isn't so obvious it couldn't have been missed by a casual glance. Thus, suddenly discovering a convenient boulder or tree is not allowed. A more subtle example would be making use of a slight or abrupt change in elevation, which wouldn't be indicated on the play surface.

It requires two characters to block one foe's movement. This maintains the rule that you can't choose rearward stance unless you've got two characters protecting you. If there are more than twice as many foes as heroes, the foes cannot be blocked at all; they overrun any blockers.

Stormcrow wrote:The One Ring requires some rules changes if you're going to try to play a battle with miniatures. Here are some suggestions.

Sweet! Thanks. Have you tried these in action? I could imagine using miniatures makes the combat a bit longer, but maybe the added visuals and tactical depth are worth it.