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Re: Using TOR for Dark Age Arthurian Britain
Posted: Tue Oct 10, 2017 7:30 pm
by Valarian
I'd suggest either Keltia, if you can still get a copy, or Age of Arthur.
Re: Using TOR for Dark Age Arthurian Britain
Posted: Wed Oct 11, 2017 8:10 am
by Magus76
Terisonen wrote: ↑Tue Oct 10, 2017 9:43 am
I'm just doing the contrary, adapting Pendragon system to Middle-earth using some components of TOR...
That really sounds interresting! I simply love TOR and feel no need to switch system, but I also really like Pendragon, hence the enthusiasm. How’s it working out so far?
Re: Using TOR for Dark Age Arthurian Britain
Posted: Wed Oct 11, 2017 8:19 am
by Magus76
For Hope/Shadow, wouldn’t it be on par with the arthurian themes of Christianity and Paganism if one used Faith/Corruption? This would make the connection to god/goddess/nature/christ/grail a driving factor for all characters, depending on cultural and religious background. System-wize it would be the same, but it shifts the the theme of the seting as well as the motive for characters to push on.
Re: Using TOR for Dark Age Arthurian Britain
Posted: Wed Oct 11, 2017 9:20 am
by Terisonen
Magus76 wrote: ↑Wed Oct 11, 2017 8:10 am
Terisonen wrote: ↑Tue Oct 10, 2017 9:43 am
I'm just doing the contrary, adapting Pendragon system to Middle-earth using some components of TOR...
That really sounds interresting! I simply love TOR and feel no need to switch system, but I also really like Pendragon, hence the enthusiasm. How’s it working out so far?
Some mechanism fit well, and some don't. I especially struggle with corruption. Finding a simple and elegant system is not so simple.
Re: Using TOR for Dark Age Arthurian Britain
Posted: Wed Oct 11, 2017 12:53 pm
by Glorelendil
Magus76 wrote: ↑Wed Oct 11, 2017 8:19 am
For Hope/Shadow, wouldn’t it be on par with the arthurian themes of Christianity and Paganism if one used Faith/Corruption? This would make the connection to god/goddess/nature/christ/grail a driving factor for all characters, depending on cultural and religious background. System-wize it would be the same, but it shifts the the theme of the seting as well as the motive for characters to push on.
I dunno...which one is "Hope" and which is "Shadow". I say that only half in jest. (Try reading Bernard Cornwell's trilogy...he may have a different answer than Mallory.)
But, sure, you could adapt Hope/Shadow but that still feels like a hack to me. Again, I'd start with what you think the most important themes are. Certainly the conflict between Christianity and Paganism is one. But so is the conflict between Anarchy (in the Dark Ages sense) and Order, of which Chivalry vs. "Barbarism" (not quite the right word) is a sub-conflict.
In M-e the whole point is to fight a losing battle against the Shadow. What is the "point" of being a hero in the age of Arthur? There are multiple possible...and good...answers, but I'd figure that out before I chose a system or adapted one.
(To offer another example, the "point" in traditional D&D is to become really powerful, slay god-like monsters, and take their stuff. The system is designed around that premise and it works.)
Re: Using TOR for Dark Age Arthurian Britain
Posted: Wed Oct 11, 2017 4:19 pm
by Magus76
Glorelendil wrote: ↑Wed Oct 11, 2017 12:53 pm
Magus76 wrote: ↑Wed Oct 11, 2017 8:19 am
For Hope/Shadow, wouldn’t it be on par with the arthurian themes of Christianity and Paganism if one used Faith/Corruption? This would make the connection to god/goddess/nature/christ/grail a driving factor for all characters, depending on cultural and religious background. System-wize it would be the same, but it shifts the the theme of the seting as well as the motive for characters to push on.
I dunno...which one is "Hope" and which is "Shadow". I say that only half in jest. (Try reading Bernard Cornwell's trilogy...he may have a different answer than Mallory.)
But, sure, you could adapt Hope/Shadow but that still feels like a hack to me. Again, I'd start with what you think the most important themes are. Certainly the conflict between Christianity and Paganism is one. But so is the conflict between Anarchy (in the Dark Ages sense) and Order, of which Chivalry vs. "Barbarism" (not quite the right word) is a sub-conflict.
In M-e the whole point is to fight a losing battle against the Shadow. What is the "point" of being a hero in the age of Arthur? There are multiple possible...and good...answers, but I'd figure that out before I chose a system or adapted one.
(To offer another example, the "point" in traditional D&D is to become really powerful, slay god-like monsters, and take their stuff. The system is designed around that premise and it works.)
Hmmm, I might have been unclear in my definition, but for me both Christianity and Paganism would be represented by Faith depending on what background the character has, and Corruption would in this case represent destructive forces, perhaps not as clearly defined as in ME, but destructive and negative none the less. The forces that lures characters away from staying true to Arthur, god, Knightly ideals, nature, finding the Grail and such. It would represent the battle between the forces that try to heal the land in their own unique way or that which tries to destroy it. Mordred comes to mind as a representative of that darker force that aims to kill the King and thus the land itself.
But yes, I also agree that it is good to find the themes that are important to the setting, and then find or build a system that fits.
Re: Using TOR for Dark Age Arthurian Britain
Posted: Sat Oct 14, 2017 7:33 pm
by Corvo
I thought about using TOR as a basis for an Arthurian game.
In the game I was envisioning, the "Bout of Madness" is the straying from the honorable path and giving in to the lure of gold, power, pride. The moment when the baser passions overcome the character's better judgement.
Re: Using TOR for Dark Age Arthurian Britain
Posted: Fri Nov 24, 2017 7:25 pm
by DavetheLost
I think Hope, Shadow and Corruption would work well in the context of the Grail Quest, and remember that a Pagan Grail was one of the great Treasures of Britain.
I would picture a TOR Arthurian game as being a bit more fantastical that Cornwell's very historical-realist take. Mabinogian would not be bad inspiration. And JRRT did say that Middle Earth was in part his attempt to craft an "English" mythology.
Re: Using TOR for Dark Age Arthurian Britain
Posted: Tue Nov 28, 2017 6:14 am
by Er-Murazor
Valarian wrote: ↑Tue Oct 10, 2017 7:30 pm
I'd suggest either Keltia, if you can still get a copy, or Age of Arthur.
Hopefully the mods will indulge me and not thwack me for mentioning it, but Keltia and Yggdrasill are rather interesting and its unfortunate Cubicle7 and Le 7ème Cercle had to part ways. I understand there is to be a 3rd (and I guess final) RPG set in the same "shared universe", but focused on post-Roman Gaul and/or Brittany. Maybe it will deal with Sigurd & Gudrun, etc. I do hope for a new English translation someday because I like what I've read. I also understand (and correct me if I'm wrong) the original French editions were full color?
Anyway, I would say that Keltia is definitely one of the most authentic feeling Arthurian RPG settings yet. Its not full of all out anachronisms like many versions that have come and gone over the years.