Multiple Attacks

[Rich H]

Working from memory here but I go with the following in my game:

* The character has to be in forward stance and the enemies subject to this attack must be engaged with the character in question - although I sometime play a bit fast and loose with the engaged part of this

* A Hope point is used to make a multiple attack action

* The player simply splits his success dice across the enemies he wishes to attack, equally or not, but at least one success die must be allocated to each adversary

* All attacks must succeed or they all fail

* Attack splitting is capped by the character's Valour rating

... This works pretty well for me; it's restrictive in a number of ways so isn't at all like pressing an "I win" button as it's only worth doing in certain circumstances and I'm confident it will be more costly than any official rule regarding multiple attacks that may be applied through cultural virtues or rewards. In addition the costs balance out the fact that the feat die is rolled for each attack made as part of the action and the actual rule around splitting of the success dice pool is simple and easy to understand/remember.

[HorusZA]

Working from memory here but I go with the following in my game:

* The character has to be in forward stance and the enemies subject to this attack must be engaged with the character in question - although I sometime play a bit fast and loose with the engaged part of this

* A Hope point is used to make a multiple attack action

* The player simply splits his success dice across the enemies he wishes to attack, equally or not, but at least one success die must be allocated to each adversary

* All attacks must succeed or they all fail

* Attack splitting is capped by the character's Valour rating

... This works pretty well for me; it's restrictive in a number of ways so isn't at all like pressing an "I win" button as it's only worth doing in certain circumstances and I'm confident it will be more costly than any official rule regarding multiple attacks that may be applied through cultural virtues or rewards. In addition the costs balance out the fact that the feat die is rolled for each attack made as part of the action and the actual rule around splitting of the success dice pool is simple and easy to understand/remember.

Our house-rule is quite similar to yours but with fewer restrictions:

1.) You must be in forward stance
2.) You divide your Success Dice anyway you choose amongst any number of opponents engaged with you with a minimum of 1 dice each.
3.) Called shots are not permitted.
4.) As you resolve each attack in turn, if you roll an <EYE> all remaining attacks are lost.

The primary intent behind our house-rule is to keep the forward stance a viable choice even as weapon skill gets to 3 or 4.

[Glorelendil]

One of the ideas I've contemplated recently is allowing an extra attack after killing an opponent with a Great Success or better. The next attack is at -1 skill, and you can chain that twice in a row in Forward, or only once in Open.

Caveat: this was one of my ideas for a Virtue only available to Slayers, when I was trying to come up with Virtues for each Calling. (Here)

[atgxtg]

While I think this is the most simple and valid idea I've read regarding multiple attacks, I also think that it might numerically give a the hero a slight advantage: while the success die are split, the feat die is, in fact, doubled (or tripled if attacking three enemies).

I don't believe that splitting dice does give the hero an advantage. In fact, I think a "cleave" type of multiple attacks (where dropping a foe triggers the option for another attack) actually gives the hero a greater advantage. Reason being that the TN to hit an opponent is probably going to be 11 or better after parry bonuses, even in a forward stance. A hero only 1 skill die has got about a 50-50 chance of hitting. As splitting dice would reduce the chances of rolling sixes, the chances of getting great and/or extraordinary successes are significantly reduces, so damage inflicted will usually be just the base amount for the weapon. That makes it much less likely that the character will drop an opponent, and so he will probably get attacked multiple times, and, in a forward stance, probably get hit and take at least as much damage as he gives out. Rolling two or three feat dice is a mixed blessing, as it also doubles and triples the chances of a a player rolling an Eye and triggering a called shot, (and if the hero fumbles a called shot of his own he is in BIG trouble). Even in the hero "breaks even" in the damage given/taken department it's a loss for the player, since we don't need the goblins to survive and return next game session, but we do need the PC hero.


Try a couple of test fights pitting a hero with skill 4 or so up against two or three goblins and I think you'll see what I mean. It takes a character will a high parry and very good weapon skill to just break even against goblins. And they're about as weak as the opposition gets.

[Falenthal]

Good points, atgxtg.

Also, it makes the rule simpler to apply. This looks good to me. Maybe even in the weak side, from your examples, but fast and easy.

[Yepesnopes]

Are you discussing of multiple attacks against different enemies? or the idea of allowing multiple attacks in general (against multiple as well as against a single enemy)?

Splitting the dice (evently) between attacks may work, it is the old RuneQuest way. I still have my doubts though, due to the fact that you are rolling more feat dice, specially if you have a character with some virtues like "Fair shot" or a weapon with "Keen" quality.

[Rich H]

Are you discussing of multiple attacks against different enemies? or the idea of allowing multiple attacks in general (against multiple as well as against a single enemy)?

Splitting the dice (evently) between attacks may work, it is the old RuneQuest way. I still have my doubts though, due to the fact that you are rolling more feat dice, specially if you have a character with some virtues like "Fair shot" or a weapon with "Keen" quality.

That's why I think you need to associate a cost and a limitation to it. It's why I went with the stance restriction, Hope usage, and Valour limit in my house rule. Just didn't want it to become an "I win" button and also wanted to make it more expensive than any (potential) future official rule that came out.

[Glorelendil]

Honestly it's the Spear of the Last Alliance that makes this hard. I think you almost have to also modify that Cultural Reward if you're going to allow any sort of multiple attacks. I would never choose that reward: a point of Hope is just too expensive for an attack that might not even hit, never mind the cost of the Valour point to acquire it. So to make a multi-attack mechanic that is sufficiently worse than that just doesn't seem very useful.

[Rich H]

Honestly it's the Spear of the Last Alliance that makes this hard. I think you almost have to also modify that Cultural Reward if you're going to allow any sort of multiple attacks. I would never choose that reward: a point of Hope is just too expensive for an attack that might not even hit, never mind the cost of the Valour point to acquire it. So to make a multi-attack mechanic that is sufficiently worse than that just doesn't seem very useful.

Very true. I'd forgotton that I'd houseruled the cost of that away.

[Falenthal]

Honestly it's the Spear of the Last Alliance that makes this hard. I think you almost have to also modify that Cultural Reward if you're going to allow any sort of multiple attacks. I would never choose that reward: a point of Hope is just too expensive for an attack that might not even hit, never mind the cost of the Valour point to acquire it. So to make a multi-attack mechanic that is sufficiently worse than that just doesn't seem very useful.

Very true. I never liked that Reward: elves, who have always problems with their Hope points, need Hope points to activate lots of Rewards and Virtues. Maybe there's a point in it, but I feel it's too much. I can see the SotLA's ability only activated 4 or 5 time in the whole life of the character... and not even hitting all of them.