A new way to handle Standing (Alternate Rules)

[Rich H]

Thanks for all the replies, Rich!

Regarding the first issue, yes, I think it's too much bookeeping to lower Standing over the years. You have to write down when the Standing was gained, calculate time passed for every player AND every culture,... Too much for me.
I think your solution of "-1 level per year if nothing signifiant is made to prevent it" it's fine with me.

I think you're right, I've altered the pdf accordingly: https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/795 ... 0Rules.pdf *

* Note, I've also added clarification points etc on page 2 as well.

As per the regions, I agree that it can depend on the deed performed. In DoM, the Werewolf attacked Woodmen and Elves alike. So, while the adventure to kill it originates in Woodmen-Town, I think that succesfully ending the beasts life should raise the heroes Standing among Woodmen and Elves alike. And maybe the Beornings won't even notice, as they had their own problems and were not affected by the Werewolves attacks.

I agree, I think the rules allow for a bit of flexibility and adjudication by the Loremaster for this.

And for the Hobbits, I agree that this Renown/standing that's applied to all cultures, not only to your hometown, can solve the problem I have with them. I don't know if spending treasure to raise any Standing should be ok, but that also depends on the particularities of the campaign and what the hobbit player wants to do with his character.

I think it's still okay to raise Standing (ie, effectively home culture renown) using Treasure. For my campaign, Treasure is a bit of a rarity though and I didn't like the idea of increasing its availability as that's not really the type of game I want to play, so increases through character actions, deeds, and achievements is more often used.

The two elements can both be used to increase Standing though, it's just that they can't be combined to increase Standing from one level to the next. I don't have an issue with that though some others may; in those cases I think Doc's way of working would be better for them (although I'm not sure how you'd implement varying Renown in other cultures within such rules). Something for others to mull over should they want/need it.

I love the TOR system - it's great to tweak; extremely robust and open to fine tuning and adding elements to the strong base mechanics.

[Rich H]

... And the corresponding part of the character sheet would need to look something like this:

[PipeSmoker]

Very interesting discussion, addressing an easily overlooked area of the game. I'll throw my 2 cents in.

1) I'd keep it very simple. Only 1 rating (say Standing) and I'd focus in providing alternative ways to alter it other that Treasure, not much else. These ways should be Deeds, like fighting in battles, defeating foes, sharing wealth, achieving truces and trades and diplomatic feats. This simply needs to be integrated in RAW, same way as in TFW (ie. heroes play a major role in the Gloomyfold affair).
This single option is good for those that don't want to be bothered much in keeping track of numbers or that prefer things a little more vague and story based.

2) As above (which I think is very much needed) AND add Renown, a second rating, which is "Standing" in all the Free People (and maybe not only that) and make it related mostly to Deeds. Deeds that ALSO have an impact going beyond the boundaries of your home land.

Any merchant in Dale or Esgaroth can have a high Standing by sharing wealth and contributing in any way to his community (providing rare and needed goods, throwing parties and ending up having what may be called "political influence" in the court and counsel, which is what seems to be Standing in RAW), but Renown is for those that deafeat a monster, open a new path through Mirkwood or take a riddle game with a dragon. Their names will be spoken of in every culture, even if they are unwealthy and somewhat misteryous stragers, and they could be permitted in foreing halls.
I'm thinking of Gandalf, being famous all over the lands, while not having any real influence over any king or people other than his name. Or the heroes of old, like Fram who killed Scatha, or the fabled and unlikely personalities of the present, like Bilbo who spoke with Smaug...

How to make it in rules is now beyond me, I would be glad just being able to have all this stuff in mind while loremastering...

[doctheweasel]

What I find a little odd is that a heroe can perform a great deed, gain Renown points, and decide not to spend them at all.

That's a good point. I think I will change the original post to reflect that having the requisite number of points raises Standing automatically. It should still be an Undertaking to spend Treasure to gain Renown Points.

Name change
I'm also tempted to change the name of the currency, since there's a lot of mixed signals in this converstaion between this system and Rich's Renown system. The most fitting would be Esteem (dropping "points" because it falls a little flat on the tongue).

Scale
I originally considered doing this all in terms of Treasure, as many here have suggested, but then you have both Treasure and Treasure equivalent, and at that stage you need a name for Treasure equivalent because the alternative is too confusing.

It's sounding like everyone likes using the Treasure "scale" rather than converting Treasure to the Renown/Esteem scale (4:1). It certainly allows for more granular rewards and after reading the reactions makes the whole thing less confusing.

Standing upkeep
What do you all think of the alternate Standing Upkeep rules? Since we have a way to track how close one is to the next Standing Rank, it seemed appropriate to dig into that pool rather than have the player throw a few bucks at their hometown.

Thank you all for the discussion and feedback. I'll post a revamped version of this soon.

[Glorelendil]

Name change
I'm also tempted to change the name of the currency, since there's a lot of mixed signals in this converstaion between this system and Rich's Renown system. The most fitting would be Esteem (dropping "points" because it falls a little flat on the tongue).

Fame? Goodwill? Accountants should like that one...it's practically the same meaning.

I actually prefer Renown, though.

[Yepesnopes]

Guys, I like a lot what you are doing. In our games, standing is totally overlooked. Mainly because treasure is not a big thing in our games.

I will tell my LM to check upon your house rules.

Cheers,
Yepes

[Rich H]

I'm also tempted to change the name of the currency, since there's a lot of mixed signals in this converstaion between this system and Rich's Renown system. The most fitting would be Esteem (dropping "points" because it falls a little flat on the tongue).

I don't think we have to find different words for what are two separate house-rule systems for the same (or very similar) things. Personally, if I were you, I'd just keep it called Renown - players will be able to figure out there are two (or more) different systems to choose from assuming they want to adopt something extra than the RAW.