Hope Expenditure Rate

[Majestic]

So since discovering that I've been refreshing my players' Hope scores too liberally, I figure I should find out what a more 'proper' rate is for players in this game.

Based on the fact they were getting them back again, my players have likely been considerably more free in their spending habits. Checking on the numbers, one player spent 3 last game. Another had notes from multiple sessions ago, and he spent 6 (and he's an Elf with only 10 to begin with!).

So what rate have you seen your players using? Do they just use 1-2 points a session? Do some spend half a dozen or more sometimes?

[zedturtle]

We have a Hobbit and a Beorning, so we have a fairly full Fellowship Pool. The consumption tends to vary, depending on the scenes and who's active. I imagine most players spend two points or so, expecting to get them back (PbP, so we handle Fellowship Pool at the end of a 'session' aka about a month's worth of play). Sometimes folks get aggressive and go down by four or five points. This is the system working as intended, the characters are starting to see skill level 4... they should be having less than maximum Hope.

[Stormcrow]

Players should spend however many points they feel like spending. If they find themselves with too few, that's their problem. They'll do better once they have a bout of madness and a shadow flaw.

[Majestic]

Thanks, zed. I'm trying to figure out that rate, being as I've had them doing it wrong all along.

Players should spend however many points they feel like spending. If they find themselves with too few, that's their problem. They'll do better once they have a bout of madness and a shadow flaw.

I get that, Stormcrow. My problem is that I blew it, thinking they got all Hope replenished each session (rather than just the Fellowship Points). So my group has been spending them based on the assumption that they get them back (like Courage in the old Decipher game, or Hero Points in Star Wars, or many other similar mechanics).

I now need to break the news to them (next session), and I'll probably just keep them where they are (Hope-wise) and then administer it correctly from this point on.

[Falenthal]

I have 4 players, with 4 points of Fellowship Pool. They normally use up all FP points every adventure. When it comes to their own Hope points, they use none to 2 points per adventure.
In fact, we could say they use an average of 1 FP and 1 Personal Hope Point.

Of course, some situations or adventures are more demanding, and some players accept better to fail a roll than others. I think the maximum of personal Hope Points spent have been 4 in a single adventure (by the Dwarf, who happens to be the hero with fewer Hope Points and higher Shadow Points... ).

[Rich H]

I now need to break the news to them (next session), and I'll probably just keep them where they are (Hope-wise) and then administer it correctly from this point on.

... I personally think that's the best way to go. It'd be tricky to try and estimate how they would have spent their Hope as they would have likely managed it differently if they'd have known what the actual rules around it refreshing were.

[Murcushio]

My own group tends to fluctuate based on the circumstances and, more importantly, on how we learned the mechanic worked, which took some time.

At first, we barely spent Hope at all. People would rather fail the roll than spend Hope points, even hemming and hawing over things that were visibly critical, like Protection tests. It was a limited resource, after all! Nobody wanted to spend down.

After a number of sessions of that, people eventually realized that we were constantly topped off, and that we had this giant Fellowship pool (party has a Hobbit and a Beorning in it) we were never using. So they started spending.

Spending liberally.

Because we had such a large Fellowship pool, it took folks awhile to draw down, but draw down they did. A bunch of people suddenly were at three or four points regularly and getting edgy.

From then on it, it's been as follows; everyone tries to spend no more than two Hope points a session. If they need to spend more than that, they'll draw against the "buffer" having a Hobbit and a Beorning provides. If we exceed THAT, they'll spend future sessions trying to spend less than two points, so they can refill to what they consider reasonable parity. For most of us that's somewhere between ten and twelve points, which is full Hope (if you're me, the Beorning) or much less than full (our Hobbit player.)

Sometimes, we just end up going to town on Hope expenditure, for in-character or practical reasons, and that can wreck the curve. Examples: our Barding had to tank a troll awhile back. Said troll kept getting REAL lucky and the player spent four points of Hope making Protection tests, because those are kind of vital to not dying, you know?

As for myself, my character, through a story way to lengthy to get into, gets into a drinking contest with Bombur whenever she's in Dale. (I have Robust, which is my "buy-in"; without Robust he would simply auto-win. He does auto-win the pie-eating contest. Listen, I told you it was a long story.)

I will spend any amount of Hope to win that. Any amount. I once spent seven points in one go on drinking-related Athletics tests to beat him. By the final round of drinks the TN we were both going after was like 28 or 30. It's a matter of personal honor. My PC had to husband Hope for a full month of sessions after that to rebuild her pool, and it was worth it.

So Hope expenditure can be weird, especially while you're learning the mechanic.

[Majestic]

Thanks everyone, that really helps! And great story, Mercushio!

I now need to break the news to them (next session), and I'll probably just keep them where they are (Hope-wise) and then administer it correctly from this point on.

... I personally think that's the best way to go. It'd be tricky to try and estimate how they would have spent their Hope as they would have likely managed it differently if they'd have known what the actual rules around it refreshing were.

That's what I'm thinking, too. I was a bit concerned that one of the players might have spent way more than they would have otherwise, but I don't anticipate it being too big of a problem. Three of the characters are fairly new to the party, and today I checked with another long-time member (when at his house playing a different RPG) and his Woodman is currently at 10 out of 14. So I'm hopeful that the numbers will be pretty close to where they otherwise would have been (had I been doing this correctly from the beginning).

[MattG]

We run online games with posts of PCs being written with rolls, mechanics and consultations behind the scenes. Each post is usually rather long, a view of events from each hero viewpoint. There is more storytelling than dice rolling. Then comes LM post and often it’s based on general directions from players. The usually give pretty accurate description of situations where they would like to use Hope. Sometimes it is spend for them by LM decision in fighting scenes or to achieve something important to the story where otherwise it would be missed or lead to bad consequences.

Since we play per one post every 7-10 days for players (on average 2 to 3 A4 pages of writing per one post of each PC) and about 5-7 days for LM post (3 to 8A4 pages), after a few posts, sometimes 3, another time 4, they get 1 point of Hope back if their focus was intact. The fellowship pool is refreshed every round. The spending rate of each PC is usually 0-3 points per every 2 PC posts.

They have their individual pools of Hope fully refreshed every winter fellowship phase and a point or two every short FP between smaller adventures. So far only two players received their first flaws, Barding in Stewed Hobbit (12 rounds of playing after Don't leave the path -11 rounds ) and Beorning in Kinstrife which was the longest so far (21 rounds of playing).

The most Hope spend in single round was the night of the battle at the Ring Fort and rescuing the Hobbit from the caves (PC spent on average 4 points each) and encounter with Valter the Bloody (Barding PC highhandedly spent 5+ points during his evening/night/morning visit in the bandit's camp).

[Majestic]

Thanks, MattG. That's especially interesting for me, being as we have just played through those very same adventures!

It raises an interesting dynamic, too. Those who run the game via methods other than table-top (PBP, forums, PBEM, etc.) really have to come up with their own way of managing not only Advancement and Experience Point awards, but how often to refresh the Fellowship pool.