Voluntary bout of madness?

[Michebugio]

Notable Bouts of madness in The Hobbit and Lord of the Rings - just an exercise to understand how Bouts of madness should be played:

- Thorin Oakenshield right after the end of the Quest of Erebor (Dragon-sickness or, more probably, Curse of Vengeance);

- Bilbo Baggins at his birthday party, trying to keep the Ring for himself (Dragon-sickness, but maybe also Wandering-madness for his sudden farewell);

- Boromir in Amon Hen, trying to steal the Ring from Frodo (Lure of Power or Dragon-sickness);

- Pippin when looking in the Palantìr (Lure of Secrets);

- Denethor after Faramir is almost fatally injured (undefined - maybe Lure of Power?);

- Frodo at the top of Orodruin (Dragon-sickness). About time for that: it's impressive he didn't suffer any other Bout of madness during the journey!

[Falenthal]

- Pippin when looking in the Palantìr (Lure of Secrets);

Pippin was a Scholar after all! I knew it!

[Blubbo Baggins]

"Usually, a bout of madness is resolved right after the character got the Eye result, but the Loremaster can choose to postpone the reaction, letting the player keep control of his character, only to snatch it from him at a later, more appropriate moment. (the Loremaster might choose to do so especially when the roll that provoked the bout of madness wasn’t dramatically relevant)."

I'll put the emphasis on another sentence. Going mad during a battle is very dramatically relevant. I would not postpone the bout of madness in that case, but I would if the player sauronned a meaningless roll before battle.

On the other hand, if the player can find a good reason for having his bout of madness at a given time, I might allow him.

Actually, a couple years ago I played a Dwarf, and my PC suffered a bout of madness. The LM did not have it trigger during the battle. Instead, when it was clear we won and the orcs started running away (and it would have been wise for the group to let them go and move on), he triggered the madness. My Dwarf ran after the orcs, heedless of danger, full of bloodlust. The orcs were overtaken, and the madness did not end until one of my fellow PCs tried to stop my character, and I took a swing at him (and would have wounded him! had not his Hound taken the blow). It felt like quite appropriate timing for the bout - again, just to respond to the idea that the middle of a battle isn't always the most thematic time, it really just depends.

[Majestic]

I wouldn't allow the player to trigger it either. There are some meta choices (like spending Hope) that the player can manage, but others should really be left up to the Loremaster.

I'm not sure Pippin fits the Lure of Power progression: Haughty, Scornful, Scheming, Treacherous.

I think the One Ring (though not easy to make game stats for, as said in Rivendell), could work similar to Dragon-sickness, though Frodo on Mount Doom could also have triggered a Revelation episode (specifically Do not tempt me!). Another possibility for a Bout of Madness (or Revelation episode) would be when Frodo turned on Sam (and believed Gollum).

[Stormcrow]

Another possibility for a Bout of Madness (or Revelation episode) would be when Frodo turned on Sam (and believed Gollum).

... in the film.

[Majestic]

Another possibility for a Bout of Madness (or Revelation episode) would be when Frodo turned on Sam (and believed Gollum).

... in the film.

Yeah, I'd forgotten how much they'd changed that portion (it's been years since I've reread the books, but I've seen the movie many times).

Certainly Saruman succumbed to Lure of Secrets in both, though much moreso in the movies.

[Stormcrow]

Yes, Lure of Secrets was clearly written with Saruman in mind.

[Angelalex242]

Frodo clearly had a Wisdom of 6 if he managed to endure exactly one bout of madness the entire trip to Mt. Doom. Even with the Hobbit's cultural advantage, the TN on the One Ring is what, 20? 30?

Even then, that one bout of madness was such an autofail that Eru planned for it and compensated for it.

Peter Jackson doesn't count, naturally.

[Rich H]

Frodo clearly had a Wisdom of 6 if he managed to endure exactly one bout of madness the entire trip to Mt. Doom. Even with the Hobbit's cultural advantage, the TN on the One Ring is what, 20? 30?

Highest TN rating in TOR is 20 for Daunting. I'd therefore go higher for the One Ring TN at around 22 or 24. A character with Wisdom of 4 (which is more in line for Frodo than the maximum of 6, which would be silly) is going to get an average roll of just under 20. Seems to fit well as Frodo would regularly be burning Hope or the Fellowship Pool when resisting the charms of the Ring; his Heart helping him make the TN a good few times. Gradually though, those failed rolls would slowly be adding Shadow Points and eventually, he'd become Miserable and then he failed the test to throw the ring into the fires of Mount Doom and, likely, also suffered a Bout of Madness.

[Angelalex242]

Depends on whether you view wisdom as mental toughness or having to act like Elrond. If the former, Frodo might well qualify for his 6.