Repelling charges

[Otaku-sempai]

Create a new Called Shot of 'Staggered' and apply a different mechanic rather than knocked down; maybe a slightly tempered version of just halving an individual's Parry Bonus or something?

I've been reluctant to introduce new called shots, but I have seen others house-rule them. Staggered could cause the victim to miss a turn or have some other effect.

[Rich H]

Create a new Called Shot of 'Staggered' and apply a different mechanic rather than knocked down; maybe a slightly tempered version of just halving an individual's Parry Bonus or something?

I've been reluctant to introduce new called shots, but I have seen others house-rule them. Staggered could cause the victim to miss a turn or have some other effect.

I deliberately avoided suggesting miss a turn as you've effectively got the same problem as Glorelendil described before - ie, PCs vs one enemy, and I thought you'd want to avoid that.

[Otaku-sempai]

Yeah, I'd love to see a new Called Shot mechanic unique to hammers.

I'd also be ok with some weapons causing a knockdown on a failed Protection test, instead of causing a Wound. That wouldn't count as at-will.

I'm not sure that I would want to see a called shot--any called shot--replace a wound, so the effects of a called shot should not be too severe.

I deliberately avoided suggesting miss a turn as you've effectively got the same problem as Glorelendil described before - ie, PCs vs one enemy, and I thought you'd want to avoid that.

Glorelendil has more of a problem with that than I do, but I take your meaning. Another alternative is that the recipient of a Stagger might have to go last regardless of which side had the Initiative. But several possibilities suggest themselves.

[Glorelendil]

My suggestion was to impose a Moderately Hindered penalty and call it "Daze" or "Stun". In some situations that could be really useful.

[aramis]

Getting back to repelling charges....

It occurs to me that the modeling done by the rules is rather limited. It presumes that a cav vs cav will stop and engage; that's rather ahistorical restriction (many times, cav vs cav was essentially two units riding a big circle in opposite directions and charging through each the other coming and going), especially given that they allow wheeling about and charging again in a cav-only vs foot.

[Falenthal]

After being able to get Horse-lord, I have a few questions about the Riding in Combat rules.
Some have been more or less answered here before, but I'd like to learn if there're other opinions:

1) When two mounted groups charge at each other (rohirrim vs. wolf-riders), on an open field where there's no defensor and attacker (both are attackers, so to say), the initiative is simply resolved by rolling an opposed Battle test, right? Any other way of doing it, if there's no surprise or such?

Charge attempts are resolved in order of initiative.

2)

A group composed exclusively of riders facing a group
of footmen may try to charge their foes, sweep by them,
and then wheel back and charge again. For an additional
charge to be allowed, all charging characters must have
passed their Riding test in the previous charge. As soon as
a rider fails a Riding test the combatants are considered
to have entered into contact and combat at close quarters
is initiated.

Does this mean that a group with 3 mounted rohirrim and an unmounted dunleding (or someone with a horse that cannot enter combat, like a Riding-horse (rouncy)) can NEVER charge on their enemies? And, even if all 4 members where mounted, as soon as one of them fails a Riding test, ALL of them must quit Charging?

There might be special situations where the LM might rule otherwise, like 3 horsemen charging and sweeping, while an elven archer is loosing volleys from the distance. Maybe the archer would'nt count for the exclusiveness of the group. But that's situational ruling, not what the RAW basics say.
Do you understand it like that? Because it seems like it's difficult to mantain a charge for several rounds (which might be ok), but also it's difficult to have a group that can Charge in the first place.

[Dunkelbrink]

I'd say yes to question 1; with no clear attacker a roll of Battle decides initiative.

Question 2: I read the rules in Horselords as repeating charges, with wheeling and stuff, should be considered a rare case. To answer your question of the three mounted heroes and the unmounted Dunlending: yes they can charge, just not more than once. If you look at the new order of battle there is an extra "charge phase". But without the whole party being mounted it's a matter of one charge; after that battle continues as normal.

And the other example: yeah if a party of four mounted heroes charge and one fails his Riding check the whole party is nog locked in close combat.

Since the charge is a powerful extra attack I find it reasonable to limit it this way. The wheeling and additional charges should really be a special case, for example a full group of Rohirrim attacking a band of orcs on foot. Remember that the orcs (or whoever receives the charge) can still fire bows at the cavalry.

[Falenthal]

Question 2: I read the rules in Horselords as repeating charges, with wheeling and stuff, should be considered a rare case.

But without the whole party being mounted it's a matter of one charge; after that battle continues as normal.

The wheeling and additional charges should really be a special case.

Thanks for your replies, Dunkelbrink, because I think you're fully right not just about how to understand the mechanics, but also in how to understand the whole concept of Charging+Wheeling and what should be considered "normal" and "exceptional" in Mounted Combat.

I think I forgot to consider that a character who is mounted, even if in a Fellowship of unmounted comrades, still has got a chance to do one Charge. That's a powerful extra first attack after the Opening Volleys, but before Close Quarters.

Besides, during the normal fight at Close Quarters, he's got the benefit of giving a Hindrace of -2 to most attackers that target him AND the fact that, by being on a horse, his Fatigue threshold will be lower than usual because of the Armour Encumbrance reduction (and thus he'll become Weary later).

[Indur Dawndeath]

Would you allow both an opening volley and a charge by the same player, or a choice between the two.
I would make the player select one option, not both, because when wheeling and charging, the rider is also not allowed to make a volley...

[zedturtle]

Would you allow both an opening volley and a charge by the same player, or a choice between the two.
I would make the player select one option, not both, because when wheeling and charging, the rider is also not allowed to make a volley...

Hmm... I guess that'd be a house rule, but it does sound fair.