New Loremaster looking for some tips

[Havinor]

Excellent, thanks for the replies guys. I see your point Bluejay, the Elves that feature in the books do tend to be heroes in their own right and usually have been around for hundreds/thousands of years, so its acceptable that these characters would be more powerful.
I played MERP and the Decipher LOTR game. Both were ok, but I felt they were a bit clumsy, obviously adapted from other systems, so I'm looking forward to seeing how TOR works. I'm afraid I may bore you guys with questions over the next week until the books arrive

[bluejay]

Ask away Havinor! I played both other games and was frustrated by them. Personally I think TOR is perfect for capturing the spirit of Tolkien's work. It got me gaming again after a relatively long hiatus!

[aramis]

Excellent, thanks for the replies guys. I see your point Bluejay, the Elves that feature in the books do tend to be heroes in their own right and usually have been around for hundreds/thousands of years, so its acceptable that these characters would be more powerful.
I played MERP and the Decipher LOTR game. Both were ok, but I felt they were a bit clumsy, obviously adapted from other systems, so I'm looking forward to seeing how TOR works. I'm afraid I may bore you guys with questions over the next week until the books arrive

MERP was a great game, and had great information, too bad they didn't match. (It was the light version of Rolemaster.)
Decipher's was the same engine as their Star Trek.... which was also mediocre.

Don't worry about boring us... what gamer doesn't love talking the upsides of a favorite game?

Also, in looking at the ages of Mirkwood Elf PC's, "Adventuring Age: 100-500" (2E, p 58)
As compared to Rivendell Elves "Adventuring Age: 500-1000" (Rivendell, p 131)

Not one of the PC types is of the Firstborn generation (who would be born in the First or Second Age, generally)... In fact, all the Elven PC's are intended to have been born in the last half of the third age. The special rules for Arwen and Elrond give us a taste of the true power of a legend walking. As does the rule for spending some quality time chatting with Mithrandir...

Even so, an aroused ire in a somewhat experienced PC Mirkwood Elf can be a terrible thing... Elf-light has some potent upgrades.

Also note: the game can, but doesn't "out of the box," support playing the more derring-do tone of the PJ movies...
just add a few maneuvers (volley, shield bash, melee shot), and be liberal with the uses of distinctive features and specialties.

[bluejay]

Not one of the PC types is of the Firstborn generation (who would be born in the First or Second Age, generally)...

While I understand your point about PC Elves being relatively young, I've never before seen this definition of firstborn or a 'firstborn generation'. Do you have a source for this? Given that on one side Galadriel and Cirdan both predate the First Age (and yet are not of the very first generation of Elves) and then Elrond and Arwen are many, many generations of Elves later this seems a very loose and inconsistent definition.

In the spirit of the initial question I think we are very much agreed that the High Elven PCs will be powerful but not to a point that they take away from the rest of the group. Their cultural blessing, virtues and even traits give them a sense of power that the other characters do not have but mechanically they will not consistently dominate and risk being overwhelmed by the shadow. In fact again I'd say that one of the many, many merits of The One Ring is that all of the characters feel of great mechanical benefit to the fellowship as well as adding to the story.

[zedturtle]

Yeah, it seems the confusion is arising (I think) from trying to talk about the Calaquendi/Moriquendi divide without using those terms. Those Elves (like Galadriel) who were in Valinor during the time of the Two Trees did get a significant upgrade in power. But once the Trees are destroyed, then any Elves born after that will necessarily be of lesser stature.

[Otaku-sempai]

Not one of the PC types is of the Firstborn generation (who would be born in the First or Second Age, generally)...

While I understand your point about PC Elves being relatively young, I've never before seen this definition of firstborn or a 'firstborn generation'. Do you have a source for this? Given that on one side Galadriel and Cirdan both predate the First Age (and yet are not of the very first generation of Elves) and then Elrond and Arwen are many, many generations of Elves later this seems a very loose and inconsistent definition.

I would add that Arwen and her brothers were all born during the Third Age (granted in the early years of that age). We don't know the age of Legolas of the Woodland Realm, but he might be no older (or even younger) than Arwen.

[Havinor]

That's a good point. Because Elves are ageless, I suppose how 'old' an elf is becomes largely irrelevant. It's more about the time they have spent on the earth and the experiences they have gone through. So in Legolas' case, How old is he? Does it really matter? What we gather is that he is not 'powerful' like Galadriel or Elrond, but he has other abilities that set him apart in his own way.
One thing from reading on the forums which I'm looking forward to seeing the progress of Hope failing, Shadow increasing, as the characters become more skillful/powerful. It seems like a very clever mechanic and when you think about it, it fits so well with the books.

[Rich H]

One thing from reading on the forums which I'm looking forward to seeing the progress of Hope failing, Shadow increasing, as the characters become more skillful/powerful. It seems like a very clever mechanic and when you think about it, it fits so well with the books.

It's certainly a nice dynamic but not something that is as big a deal as some may allude to - although players do have to keep a wary eye on how Shadow is progressing it is easy to reduce and makes Craft and Song very important skills, which is a nice touch. In my experience loss of Hope has largely not been too much of a problem for most of my players and their characters and Shadow is fairly straightforward to work down*. There do seem to be certain events within my campaign that have really battered some characters with regards to this though, so there are peak points where this becomes a big deal. I kinda like that; the players do have a healthy suspicion of it and it does kick in at certain points but overall it is manageable and isn't the primary mechanical focus of a campaign.

* Although the Dwarf PC has "Stiff Neck of the Dwarves" and this creates a very interesting dynamic for his player. It first seemed like an overpowered Virtue but is very tempting to the player (ie, let Shadow build up so it can be used in skill tests) but can get scary very quickly due to the low starting score of Hope for Dwarves.

[Havinor]

Now that leads me onto another question. Not having the books yet, so I don't know.... well.... anything really. I'm guessing Craft and Song would be used in the Fellowship or Year End phases? These would then be used to reduce the effect of Shadow? Do they also renew Hope?
Also, one thing that has came to mind a lot to me is can a character craft an item of high quality, not 'magical', but expertly crafted. As an example in story form....
2 characters a man and a dwarf. During a fight with orcs, the man through daring deeds and the spending of Hope, saves the dwarf, killing several orcs in the process. The dwarf, being a craftsman of some skill offers to take the man's sword and 'repair' it in the forges of Erebor (his sanctuary). During the Fellowship phase or Year End phase makes the relevant craft rolls and brings the sword back inlaid with dwarf runes telling of the battle. He names the weapon something suitably heroic and returns it to the man. Here now is a weapon which has a story of it's own and might gain fame/infamy (depending on what side your on) in the same vein as Glamdring or Orcrist (obv not on the same level).

[zedturtle]

Yep, you twigged exactly to the Heal Corruption Undertaking, where you use Song or Craft to reduce Shadow.

Your example might be a good way to explain a new Quality being applied to a weapon, which is an upgrade that improves the stats of the weapon in some way (the whole way the weapon stats interact with each other is brilliant). High Elves can take a step further and make weapons that are truly magical.