Sell me on TOR. Or not.

[finarvyn]

Here's my situation: I've owned a copy of TOR since it first came out. I bought the slipcase edition and GM screen and Lake-Town and Tales of the Wilderlands and extra dice. I've skimmed through the rules but haven't actually played The One Ring. I love the artwork maps and the overall philosophy and concept of TOR, but no one I know plays the game and so I never got around to doing more than looking at my rulebooks. While I haven't played, the TOR rules seem to fit Middle-earth better than MERP or the Decipher game or any other rules set I've seen so far.

Reading about the new 5E Middle-earth release this summer has gotten me excited about Middle-earth again, and I dusted off my old stuff and was looking through it again.I'm torn at this point on where to go with the game, and wanted some feedback.

I see three general options I might pursue:

(1) I'm considering trying to catch up with TOR. I downloaded the 1E to 2E PDF that should tell me how to upgrade my slipcase rules to the current rules. I've considered buying all of the TOR supplement rulebooks, but I'm behind by quite a few so the cost involved would be enough to make me think about it rather than just buy everything.

(2) I'm considering just holding off on TOR and waiting for the 5E Middle-earth rules to come out. This requires a smaller financial outlay (at least at the start) but also involves having to wait a lot longer for product. The other advantage is that I wouldn't have to learn a new rules set, and 5E is being run at my local game store whereas TOR is not.

(3) I could, of course, do both.

I guess a lot of what I'm wondering is what to do with the two product lines. Am I in a situation where I ought to choose one direction or the other, or are we looking at universal products which could be used as sourcebooks for both rules sets simultaneously, or do we really have any idea at this point what to expect when the new rules come out?

[Rich H]

I guess a lot of what I'm wondering is what to do with the two product lines. Am I in a situation where I ought to choose one direction or the other, or are we looking at universal products which could be used as sourcebooks for both rules sets simultaneously, or do we really have any idea at this point what to expect when the new rules come out?

At this point in time, no-one can offer you any advice on how this is going to pan out with regard to whether it will be worth purchasing both lines. However Jon (Art Director at C7) has said that TOR will continue to be an independant line although this doesn't say whether a 5e customer will get any use out of the TOR supplements with regard to setting material found there or whether it will be repeated within the 5e product line and therefore it isn't worth purchasing any TOR products.

If you have no-one to play the game with then unless you just want to get the TOR books simply because they are gorgeous and a great read then why bother?

In your situation, I'd wait and see what the summer brings. Then you can decide which way to go, and also have more of an idea if you have some gaming buddies to play with, whatever the edition.

[zedturtle]

Yeah, if getting players is the toughest bit then it might be best to consider what potential players are into. And there's no saying things can't change... I introduced TOR to my 5e group and now it's part of our regular rotation.

[finarvyn]

My player problem is that my regular group is open to new things but hardly ever gets together to play, but I have a second group at the game store but only plays 5E. So, I could try to introduce TOR to my 5E group but the game store is big into WotC's Adventurer's League so they only play 5E at the store.

[aramis]

Here's my situation: I've owned a copy of TOR since it first came out. I bought the slipcase edition and GM screen and Lake-Town and Tales of the Wilderlands and extra dice. I've skimmed through the rules but haven't actually played The One Ring. I love the artwork maps and the overall philosophy and concept of TOR, but no one I know plays the game and so I never got around to doing more than looking at my rulebooks. While I haven't played, the TOR rules seem to fit Middle-earth better than MERP or the Decipher game or any other rules set I've seen so far.

Reading about the new 5E Middle-earth release this summer has gotten me excited about Middle-earth again, and I dusted off my old stuff and was looking through it again.I'm torn at this point on where to go with the game, and wanted some feedback.

I see three general options I might pursue:

(1) I'm considering trying to catch up with TOR. I downloaded the 1E to 2E PDF that should tell me how to upgrade my slipcase rules to the current rules. I've considered buying all of the TOR supplement rulebooks, but I'm behind by quite a few so the cost involved would be enough to make me think about it rather than just buy everything.

(2) I'm considering just holding off on TOR and waiting for the 5E Middle-earth rules to come out. This requires a smaller financial outlay (at least at the start) but also involves having to wait a lot longer for product. The other advantage is that I wouldn't have to learn a new rules set, and 5E is being run at my local game store whereas TOR is not.

(3) I could, of course, do both.

I guess a lot of what I'm wondering is what to do with the two product lines. Am I in a situation where I ought to choose one direction or the other, or are we looking at universal products which could be used as sourcebooks for both rules sets simultaneously, or do we really have any idea at this point what to expect when the new rules come out?

Keep in mind - what's played at the game store is most likely not just 5E, but 5E Adventurer's League. it's a crowd that makes a great recruiting pool, but I wouldn't count on playing an ME 5E on wednesdays, fridays nor saturdays at the store... (Wed is Encounters, Sat is expeditions, and fridays are the usual MTG nights.) Why? because the store gets discounts on their MTG purchases for the amount of Wizards Organized Play events run... and ME 5E is unlikely (but not impossibly) to be included in WotC's Organized Play systems. It's in the store's interests to not let you play something else during those times.

So, you'll need to recruit players either way.
Noting that I think you're the same fInarvyn from OSTrek and Trollbridge... the following presumes you are...

Assuming you are the same Finarvyn, You've shown a strong taste, just shy of a preference, for Old School systems, and while 5E isn't Old School, it's definitely closer than is TOR to Old School. It's probably worth waiting to see if ME5 is worthy, because you're more likely to find players for it if it is.

On the other hand, TOR is freaking awesome, and really nails the feel, in ways that I can't see ANY reasonably familiar to D&D 5E generating the same level of Tolkienian feel... it's proof positive that Rules Matter. You don't need anything more to actually play what you have... Recruit a few now. Post a Request for Players and see who calls...

TOR, as written, is a magical thing if you let it run the way it intends.

[finarvyn]

Assuming you are the same Finarvyn, You've shown a strong taste, just shy of a preference, for Old School systems, and while 5E isn't Old School, it's definitely closer than is TOR to Old School. It's probably worth waiting to see if ME5 is worthy, because you're more likely to find players for it if it is.

I am the same Finarvyn, and it's nice to run into you here!

On the other hand, TOR is freaking awesome, and really nails the feel, in ways that I can't see ANY reasonably familiar to D&D 5E generating the same level of Tolkienian feel... it's proof positive that Rules Matter. You don't need anything more to actually play what you have... Recruit a few now. Post a Request for Players and see who calls...

TOR, as written, is a magical thing if you let it run the way it intends.

Good to know. TOR getting a "thumbs up" from you means a lot to me since over the years I've gotten to see what style of gaming you like and I think it's a lot like mine.

[zedturtle]

My player problem is that my regular group is open to new things but hardly ever gets together to play, but I have a second group at the game store but only plays 5E. So, I could try to introduce TOR to my 5E group but the game store is big into WotC's Adventurer's League so they only play 5E at the store.

Yep, sounds like it's a potential source of players but you're probably not going to get 100% conversion in either case.

If you do decide to introduce a group to TOR, I wrote an adventure (see my sig) specifically to teach the rules. And I also think that TOR is a great example of the rules informing and supporting the setting.

[mirdanis]

I think whether or not you will love TOR depends on what your tastes are, both in readership and in gaming. Do you prefer (A) Peter Jackson's LotR and Hobbit movies, or (B) JRR Tolkien's novels? And what really draws you to the gaming table - is it (A) number-crunching, min-maxing, dice-rolling, and damage-dealing? Or is it (B), building and developing a character through a story of adventure in an engaging fantasy world?

If your answers are (A) and (A), then I'd wait for WotC's 5e Middle Earth game, or, in the interim, try Decipher's LotR RPG, which is heavily movie-based. If your answers are (B) and (B), however, The One Ring will probably provide you with a more satisfactory gaming experience. If your answers are one of each, I'd encourage you to potentially find a different game store or group in your area and give TOR a try. TOR is a setting-driven, character-driven, and story-driven game, lighter on the game mechanics and combats than many other RPGs.

I'm a longtime D&D player, converted to Pathfinder, and about to start playing in my first 5e campaign. But I've also been a devout Tolkien fan since I was 12. I longed to combine my love of tabletop RPGs with my love of Middle Earth, especially since I often found RPGs too combat-heavy and rules-heavy for my tastes, but I'd never been in a ME-based game. When TOR came out, I really wanted to play it, but couldn't find a group to play in, partly for lack of a Loremaster. So eventually I decided, "I'll just have to start running a game myself." So I mined my FB friends list for potential interested players, found a willing group of 4, studied like h@ll, and set a date for a character creation session. That date was back in August 2015, and now, we're one session away from finishing Tales from Wilderland. It's been an incredible journey, I've grown tremendously as a player and a Loremaster, and I've even designed and run a TOR adventure of my own. One high point was when one of my players, a friend of a friend and someone I hadn't known before he joined the group, told me that this campaign was the best RPG experience he'd ever had.

[finarvyn]

Great post, mirdanis, but a hard one to answer.

Let me start with my own background. I started playing OD&D (the old white box version) back in the 1970's and have tried every version of D&D produced since. I prefer OD&D to AD&D because I like a looser rules set rather than too many details. I like 5E a lot better than 3E or 4E because the rules pull back to an earlier philosophy.

I've read both Hobbit and LotR many times, starting back in middle-school, and love re-reading the books again every couple of years. I also enjoyed the movies (LotR movies more then tH movies, but I like them all). I tried MERP for my Middle-earth play, then tried Decipher's version. In both cases I liked the simplified "adventure game" sets over the full-blown rules. Neither felt as "Tolkien-like" and just taking OD&D and limiting spellcasters.

I think that means that my answer to your post would be (b) and (b).

Now, part of my problem is that I have some number-crunchy players (as many of the younger gamers seem to be) as well as players who have enjoyed the movies but not read the books. However, they are also willing to try story-driven games such as Amber Diceless. I think that makes them split-voters. With Amber Diceless they didn't need to learn many rules, but with TOR they would be required to work a little harder. They don't often prep between sessions, so they would be relying on whatever I put together (probably starting with pregens) and what they already know about Middle-earth from the movies.

To further complicate things, my wife only plays wizards when we role play. She says that the whole point of an RPG is to be able to use magic, which she obviously cannot do in the real world. I haven't seen any wizard options in TOR, but I haven't had a chance to read much from the rulebook.

I guess I need to give TOR a try and see what happens. I like the story you told about how TOR gave your player the best RPG fun ever. That seems encouraging.

[zedturtle]

To further complicate things, my wife only plays wizards when we role play. She says that the whole point of an RPG is to be able to use magic, which she obviously cannot do in the real world. I haven't seen any wizard options in TOR, but I haven't had a chance to read much from the rulebook.

Magic in The One Ring is subtle, but present. Dwarves have Broken Spells, Wood-elves have Wood Elf Magic (and Lamp-making), High Elves have various abilities and enchantments, Woodmen have magical healing, and Beornings have spirit animal powers. If your wife is interested in having more magic options than just those, you can check out my extended magic rules (viewtopic.php?f=56&t=1586). If you use the Attention of Sauron rules in that book, you can have a fairly active magic sort of experience. If you use the Eye of Mordor rules (from Rivendell) instead (especially with a larger group) then magic will necessarily be a bit more constrained.

It may also be a bit of a presentation thing... for example one of my heroes seems to think of himself as a healer foremost and does not really self-identify as a wizard. But he hangs out with Radagast all the time (plus he has other magical allies), has magical abilities, a magical staff and a reputation for wisdom beyond his years. So a lot of people think of him as a 'little-w' wizard (compared to a 'captial-W' Wizard like Gandalf or Radagast). Your wife's character might be similar or perhap even self identify as a wizard.