Considering purchasing TOR

[Yepesnopes]

Rich and Glorelendil have pretty much summed up what for me makes TOR special.

I have played RPGs for a long time, as many of us have done on these forums. I no longer look for (in fact I stay away from) games where PCs development takes too much spot light, like in D&D or SW from FFG (to give two examples), where you have thousands of powers combinations available for your PC. It ends up irretrievably creating discussions of the sort "this combo is broken", which in my opinion, sucks up energy from both, players and GMs; an energy best spent in creating cool stories. I like when the spot light is in the story and the setting, like in TOR. Yes, I like feeling PCs develop, it is important in a RPG, but I like it in a lower profile, like in TOR.

[Rich H]

I no longer look for (in fact I stay away from) games where PCs development takes too much spot light, like in D&D or SW from FFG (to give two examples), where you have thousands of powers combinations available for your PC...

Agreed. An absolute pet hate of mine in RPGs are games where a core system then has a big stack of exception-based mechanics hanging off it in the form of powers, talents, or whatever-the-hell-the-writer decides to call them. FFG's Star Wars is one of those culprits but I submit to you something far more egregious... Ladies and Gentlemen, I offer up the 3rd Edition of Exalted; with its, I shit you not, 200+ pages of exception-based Charms and Martial Arts mechanics. The core rulebook is nearly 700 pages in length.

[Glorelendil]

Cue reference to the pseudo-intellectual Stormwind Fallacy.

Yes, there's no inherent contradiction between character options and roleplaying, but add in human nature and the results suggest that there might as well be. And I'm certainly not immune.

I'm with y'all.

[Rich H]

Yes, there's no inherent contradiction between character options and roleplaying, but add in human nature and the results suggest that there might as well be. And I'm certainly not immune.

For me a lot of it is to do with 'option paralysis'; too many and I disengage because I struggle to process them all. That and I often think some rules systems are designed not from a playability perspective but more to sell more and more splatbooks containing furthermore options. Exalted and FFG's Star Wars are perfect examples of this kind of thing - it's like the marketing and sales department have had more influence than the designers on producing the games in question. I do appreciate other players love this kind of thing though and I do like just enough options. There's a definite sweet spot for me and it does mover around a little depending on the genre and game.

[Otaku-sempai]

I no longer look for (in fact I stay away from) games where PCs development takes too much spot light, like in D&D or SW from FFG (to give two examples), where you have thousands of powers combinations available for your PC.

That never really became a problem for me until I encountered the Feat mechanic in D&D 3e which became overwhelming with the huge number of Feats that were made available over time.

[Glorelendil]

I no longer look for (in fact I stay away from) games where PCs development takes too much spot light, like in D&D or SW from FFG (to give two examples), where you have thousands of powers combinations available for your PC.

That never really became a problem for me until I encountered the Feat mechanic in D&D 3e which became overwhelming with the huge number of Feats that were made available over time.

In 5e the only thing really screwing the pooch is the low requirements for multiclassing. The permutations explode. It makes the powergamers orgasm.

[Stormcrow]

Low Power but all-pervasive magic is the hallmark of Middle Earth (and Narnia). TOR has lots of subtle magic. D&D has lots of overt magic. RuneQuest and HeroWars/HeroQuest do lots of low-powered but overt magics.

In most games in fact, the magic is pretty overt. TOR, it's subtle - mostly worked into the character abilities.

Magic is subtle! Look how subtle it is! THAT'S SO SUBTLE! I can't get over how subtle it is!

[Glorelendil]

Magic is subtle! Look how subtle it is! THAT'S SO SUBTLE! I can't get over how subtle it is!

Who are you and how did you get Stormcrow's password?

[farinal]

Thats sad to hear I thought FFG's Star Wars was more story oriented not ivory tower gaming like 3.5E was.

[Rich H]

Thats sad to hear I thought FFG's Star Wars was more story oriented not ivory tower gaming like 3.5E was.

There's a lot of potential for narrative control with the symbols on the specialised dice but I struggled with even those (over half a dozen different coloured types of dice plus multiple symbols) although I can see how they could provide a more flexible mechanism for story-telling it just feels over-defined and explicit (eg, the lists of talents etc). I do reckon you could cut it right back to the bare bones and get a really smooth game but I'd rather put together a rule system based on TOR for Star Wars or one based on the old card-based SAGA system that TSR/WotC did for Dragonlance and Marvel.