Moria

[Glorelendil]

Furthermore boxed Sets tend to be more expensive than simple books and, if they are dual-stat, this means that at least some of the customers (me included) will be doubtful about buying a more expensive product with so many pages that one cannot use.

Nonsense. We are talking Moria from C7. The price is irrelevant. Any gamer unwilling to steal from his kid’s college fund to pay for at least one copy isn’t really a gamer.

Or, you can sale a kidney.

Or both of them, and buy two copies!

I like the way you think.

[Yepesnopes]

Well, with the dual Moria box they can make stats for the AiME Balrog and no stats for the TOR Balrog

[Terisonen]

Nevertheless, the balrog has a immunity: he must be killed by Gandalf in 3018.

[Jon Hodgson]

Good morning!
To clear up some confusion:

We're taking a modular approach to the rules sections and soaking the accompanying cost ourselves. So you will get rules for both systems, and you'll be able to remove the rules section you don't require, and rest easy knowing you paid no more for it.

So let's say (for example) Moria is a box with 4 manuals in it. One will be the rules for TOR and one will be the rules for AME. You'll be able to throw one away/give it to a friend who has different tastes in rules. The price will be for a box with 3 manuals. Because as I said, we have your back. But we also want to make a Moria boxed set.

We have no plans to convert any other forthcoming title to "dual stat", and we've never used that term officially. I have personally made it clear I dislike "dual statted" products. AME and TOR remain seperate lines as we have always said.

[Terisonen]

No problem. I will be there. Even if all product becoming dual stat.

[Hermes Serpent]

You've heard it from Jon here and I heard it from Dom on Saturday at Dragonmeet. There will be no wasted pages that you are paying for and no cross-contamination of future TOR product's with nasty foreign numbers and words so let's not spread any more misinformation about what is or is not in the boxed set. Just be glad that the two lines are so complementary that C7 can afford to bring out a boxed set for Moria as boxed sets are very expensive to produce and making two versions would make each prohibitively costly.

[torus]

Clearly I am unusual in this, but I actually like dual-stat products. I like comparing the two views of an NPC or monster, and seeing how the same concept is implemented in different ways. Never had a problem with it in the ICE days and would be perfectly happy if TOR and AIME setting material was merged henceforth. Honestly, keeping them separate seems artificial and detrimental to productivity and sales.

[Rich H]

Clearly I am unusual in this, but I actually like dual-stat products. I like comparing the two views of an NPC or monster, and seeing how the same concept is implemented in different ways.

Dual stats doesn't just mean NPC and creature statistics though. In these products you'd have all kinds of things to consider like journey and encounters in adventures, additional rules in supplements like treasure and hunt rules. Doing all this would lead to messy products. Personally I appreciate them being separate as a whole and think the way C7 are going to approach this with the Moria box set of two separate system booklets is absolutely the right way to go.

[Kurt]

Just be glad that the two lines are so complementary that C7 can afford to bring out a boxed set for Moria as boxed sets are very expensive to produce and making two versions would make each prohibitively costly.

I think it's less about the cost of production and more about keeping the cost and wastage down for customers who have both TOR and AiME. Using Jon's example with four books - if a customer were to buy two seperate sets with three books in them, then they'd have two copies of the two common books. The only unique books being the TOR specific and the AiME specific books. By adding one book and offering all four books in one boxed set then customers with both systems have significantly reduced costs, especially if the price of that fourth book is being absorbed by C7. This makes me wonder how many C7 customers are buying both systems and not choosing one in preference over the other.

I really like 5e D&D and have thought about getting AiME, but I am just so pleased with TOR (now my RPG of choice) I've decided not to get the AiME stuff - more money for the TOR stuff.

[HorusZA]

We're taking a modular approach to the rules sections and soaking the accompanying cost ourselves. So you will get rules for both systems, and you'll be able to remove the rules section you don't require, and rest easy knowing you paid no more for it.

We have no plans to convert any other forthcoming title to "dual stat", and we've never used that term officially. I have personally made it clear I dislike "dual statted" products. AME and TOR remain seperate lines as we have always said.

I'm very happy with this compromise solution
Not a fan of the dual-statted books that were released during the d20 glut...